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329 Responses to “Raavan, Rajneeti (ongoing) & other silly box office tales!”
Just got done watching the film. I’ll be seeing the Hindi one as well, of course, but I saw the Tamil one first only because while Sandy’s reviewing the Hindi one for her paper…I’m gonna do the Tamil release. In any case, I was most certainly going to catch both versions.
Vikram just blew me away…on par, or even better than his Pithamagan perf. Aishwarya is also very good, and shares a crackling chemistry, full of sexual tension, with Vikram. The first half is kinda abrupt and short…would’ve liked more. The second half, surprisingly, does the delineation. And despite a rather clumsy finish, Ravanan’s strength is its bold subversion of the Hindu text (Raajneeti, take note!) which owes itself to Kamban as well as Mani’s own reading. I’m wondering if certain scenes and passages which directly invoke the Ramayana and pontificate on it will resonate in the Hindi version. The Tamil medium, given its umbilical bond with society & religion, seems naturally priviliged for such a subject. At the same time, the Hindi one has an obvious advantage vis-a-vis the Naxal politics, which given Ravanan’s Tirunelveli and Ambasamudram setting don’t gel or create the desired impact.
I’m born to a Maharashtrian father and a Tamilian mother. While I sadly can’t converse in Tamil, I can follow a movie fairly well…but I’ll still need subtitles to get the nuances. This one had thankfully released with subtitles.
Meanwhile my dad’s a Marathi journalist, but I don’t write very well in Marathi!
That’s very interesting that they released the Tamil version with English subtitles. So did you see this in Mumbai? If so, I wonder how many other non-Tamils will be drawn to this instead of the Hindi version. People complained a lot about having to read subtitles in Kites.
Look forward to your longer review on this, Abzee…I’m watching the Tamil version midweek this week, but in a few hours it’s the Hindi version.
The Indian reviews have been average to bad which isn’t the worst thing in the world given all those raves Kites and Rajneeti had recently. There’s clearly a schism between my experience of these movies and those of the reviewers…
I await the Rangan verdict. Hopefully on both versions.
The Hindi one is getting bad reviews…I’ve not bothered reading all. But I wonder if it has to do with the lead performance, and the different approaches and registers adopted by the actors. This is a very author-backed film, and the titular portrayal can make or break it.
Also I was wondering, isn’t there a certain miscasting in having Abhishek play the Ravana coveting the Sita Aishwarya, given that they are married in real life. One can sense the sexual tension between Vikram and Aishwarya, especially when he says “I envy your husband and the man who got to you first”. Will that resonate when an Abhishek says it to Aishwarya, even though we all accept that its all acting…but surely these things work on a subconscious level during a performance.
I can imagine you’re probably right about the casting…certainly it would have made things interesting if Abhishek did the Prithvi part in the Tamil version as Ratnam originally wanted…
I haven’t read the reviews myself but in skimming them one gets the sense that this is a terrible film which to put it bluntly I simply don’t buy.
It isn’t a terrible film (like Kites) by any standards.
Raavan is multiple times better and a better idea of entertainment. Even if a failure in creative pursuits (To me, none of it worked ), Raavan should still be watchable (actually it’s better than rajneeti in some respects ).
Actually abzee, abhishek being married to aishwarya isn’t the problem here. This is a genuine failure of a performance. The lack of sophistication and too many gimmicks affects the style of acting, in name of giving various ‘shades’ as per the nature of the titular role.
P.S: I’ve heard nothing but good to great reviews for Vikram in Tamil version. Want to watch it atleast for him..
Reviewers who bashed kites and rajneeti have also bashed Raavan.
Saw Raavan, don’t want to come across like a typical reviewer calling it ‘visually great, bad performances, etc’, but it went totally ‘off’ for me. Nothing worked.
I’m not saying that that the opposite isn’t true, but it doesn’t detract from the fact that my experience of late has not been those of the critics, particularly in this initial, ecstatic stage of elation for every other awful or half-decent film that comes out..
I’m glad you’ll be able to watch it today. Looking forward to your views. Not that I agree or disagree with it, but it’ll be interesting to see how one could articulate why they liked a film like this.
I don’t think BOI is reporting anything wrong here. From the reaction of even some Bachchan fans, this one seems to have missed the mark. This was always going to be a risky movie so I am not that surprised as far as box office is concerned. However, it seems that even the quality of the movie is coming under fire.
no I’m not surprised because their problems with the film are ideological. I said the same thing when JA released and people thought I was defending them. Doesn’t mean they’ll make up numbers or anything and I find this sort of piece depressing to be quite honest but the objection is ideological and the article makes this plain.
just happened to see this movie in big cinemas in navi mumbai. Average I would say…. better than Kites. But I am worried about the box office of this film. the big cinemas hall here for 4pm show was about half filled.
same time on the first day rajneeti was 90%. Bachchan aish and vikram have all done good job.
so Abhishek is still looking for his first 50+ grosser while new comers like Ranbir and Imran have a few in APKGK, JTYJN, Raajneeti. Does not seem Raavan will get him there as well.
Unfortunately, he has gambled on the wrong actor to carry out a larger-than-life role. Abhishek Bachchan is best when he is understated and reserves his bouts of anger to a few scenes. This approach worked in Yuva and Guru, but here with little socio-political context, Abhishek as Beera fails to find his feet.
Extremely saddened by how this has turned out.
Mani somehow seems to have lost the plot here and it happens to a lot of directors with their ‘pet’ projects. They lose objectivity and come out with deeply flawed and whimsical prodcuts. Raavan seems such a case.At the end of the day, if people dont like it – it just wasnt good enough. Cant blame the public.Abhi shares the blame too as this is not the first time this has happened. His judgement about commercial viability of his films seems faulty. It doesnt make him any less talented but puts multiple question marks against his commercial viability.
Abhi has a few more chances but with each costly dud, he is using them up pretty fast.
It is nauseating how some fanatics are behaving tho. But, I guess they have a cause to rejoice.
It still is pretty sad if the only pleasure one has in life is to celebrate the failure of others.
You’re totally right about Abhishek but no one in their right mind would turn down Ratnam. One has to be Aamir (and i’m not just talking about effective script sense, but also industry “currency”) in order to pass on India’s most respected commercial filmmaker.
The problem with any actor in bollywood not named Aamir Khan is that when a Mani Ratnam approaches you for a role, you don’t have the balls or the credentials to challenge him on the script. You just sign on the line and read the script on the first day of shooting!!! This is what industry thinks of a Ratnam or Bhardwaj. Once in a while, these guys are bound to fail (not talking BO). Even if Raavan is a complete disaster, every actor in bollywood except one will be outside Ratnam’s house waiting for him to sign him.
Yes,GF but I think the star-actor has to be able to sense if the director is going awry and steer them back on course. Might be difficult with such a prestigious director but this is not their first project together. 100 crores is a lot of money riding on a project. While BO is not the end all and be all, this kind of costly disasters hurt the industry as a whole. There has to be some fiscal responsibility in terms of budget and commercial viability of a product.
Yup, to some extent but writing is clear on the wall.
Still, happens. Atleast hope it is a good film for the fans of Abhi/Ash/Rathnam regardless of BO performance.
I don’t think when acting in Mani’s films actors think of commercial viability. But when they finalize the characterization of Raavan, that definitely comes into picture. Abhi is good with comedy, you can make villian mix with comedy that does wonders to box office. Who wants tos ee maniac in teh whole movie?
I didn’t like images of Gowrikar’s film. We have to wait !! I am sure he exces in Mani’s films, if he get chance again.
“Abhi has a few more chances but with each costly dud, he is using them up pretty fast.” – i agree rajen and i’ve always thought this abt. abhi…but, i do see him as a very successful producer down the line…..he may do well to concentrate more on that side of film world….
ted, abhi will be there as an actor for many many years to come – i’ve said that earlier also – but i believe that he will be far more successful as a producer…..
“”"It still is pretty sad if the only pleasure one has in life is to celebrate the failure of others.”"
Agree here…I am sad the way abhi is being dismissed..Equallly sad for HR when he was dismissed…But dont most of us here have a little saddistic streak…?? I mean so called intellectuals in this blog have made a life out of being saddistic and dismissing movies of various stars(YOu know whom i am hinting)…
Wasnt it a mistake yo hype up Raavan at the first place ???
No because I will keep dismissing some of those films today, tomorrow and forever.. it’s not about the stars but the films. I’ll defend Dil Se every day of the week and be ruthlessly dismissive of RNBDJ every day of the week too.. Is it wiser for a commercial star to do the latter than the former? Sure! But that isn’t exactly an argument for quality cinema. If one isn’t in it for this that’s one prerogative but one might not be into a great novel or a fine sitar player either. Pritam isn’t exactly better than Ravi Shankar because he sells more!
Aishwarya Rai Bachchan rocks in her performance but Abhishek Bachchan is not as good as in ‘Guru’. The weakest link of the flick is its storyline. This Mani Ratnam’s flick may be a work of art visually, but the hoi polloi will find it hard to digest despite of it being somewhat modeled on the popular epic ‘Ramayana’. However, the excellent publicity and big star cast should ensure a good opening at the box office. The film is definitely a downer by the high standards of Mani Ratnam’s earlier master pieces.
i would contradict and simply suggest he never had great years in hINDI cinema (@ box office) or even yuva tamil i heard was better product..
i heard that raavanan tamil is rocking due to vikram then i feel only reason raavan hindi isnt there abhi needs to take blame.. and also i ask a question who else from bollywood would have played raavan .. tamil has options and if tamil is hit.. it just proves mani is yet to cross barriers ..
1)All the reviews that are very positive on Raavan (Indian and Western) are all positive on Abhishek as well. For example Aseem Chabria called it his best work. So there is plenty on the other side.
2)As for the Tamil media they wouldn’t have been this harsh on Abhishek by a long stretch if it had been a Tamil film. The Bombay media has its particular problems.
3)Looking at all the reviews I’d be surprised if the film completely failed in Hindi and were a complete hit in Tamil. I doubt there will be that sort of gap. I’d be very surprised to learn otherwise.
In Tamil, you can find few actors can do raavan type of roles. Every actor has already done one or two similar roles. In Bollywood, you hardly find as the response from audience is also not great for this type.
I am quite convinced this will be a very good film.. it is actually just the opposite of what the media is making it out to be.. this IS the signature Rathnam film, at least since the 90s. Guru was the deviation. he is talented enough to produce a hit when he really needs to but his heart is much more in edgier subjects. Not that he thinks these will be flops but he clearly takes risks. The rathnam of the 80s delivered nothing box office hits once he got his first success. in the 90s he became much more of the ‘pop-auteur’ and the results have been very mixed. Thalapathy his big film with Rajni didn’t work (to give Hindi viewers a sense of what this means it’s like a very big director not working with Bachchan at his peak.. a bit like Silsila), then he had Iruvar, his most ambitious film, this too didn’t work. In between a Hollywood style adventure film also failed in Thiruda Thiruda. Roja was a success as was Bombay. Alaipayuthey (saathiya original) was a very successful film, he then followed it up with a box office disappointment in Kannathil Muthamittal. Dil Se was a washout in Hindi. Yuva/Ayudha Ezhuthu didn’t work in either language though they were hardly the worst flops either way. Guru worked in a big way. And now it obviously looks extremely ominous for Raavan.
Now I’d take all of his films that didn’t work over most of those that did. Many of these films have had a rich afterlife too. But that’s for the history books!
his movies save for a few do not invoke emotional attachments. I was watching Dil Se in the theatre with much expectations after Roja, and I was like “WTF!! what is your point Mr. Ratnam?”
Movies like Roja, Anjali managed to strike either a patriotic chord or a family chord. But his most recent works have failed in that. He has lost the ability to have the audience connect with the characters.
You are probably right Satyam but spending 100 crores of someone elses money in pursuit of such ‘good films’ is not responsible. He has in a way screwed Abhi over too with what increasingly looks like a commercial dud.It is never pretty sight when a big film crashes and when it stars one of your favs, it is very disheartening. Anyway, regardless of who is to blame, Abhi has to get more careful going forward. It is all well and good working with prestigious directors but once in a while you need to give a hit too.
Rathnam is one of the smarter money managers around.. and the price of the film given two versions is indeed economical.. distribution price is anothr matter.
I think the idea here is to make sure your film gets a good reasonable price in the context of the risk it has. And many films are over priced tremendously because someone early in the chain wants to make a big profit and some is willing to take that risk [foolishly or recklessly].
Without seeing Raavan I would just say in Hindi format Ratnams record is patchy but after success of Guru there would be significant interest in a Ratnam/Abhishek/Aish project. But is the price worth 100Cr? I don’t know what kind of business the film has to do to be considered a profitable project but surely at a big price business in India needs to be net of 100Cr with all versions. Maybe more. It’s a big ask especially when South market is cornered by one version and North by another. 2 movies this maybe but one cannot assume the Hindi version will make its “market potential” if it were a sole release compared to Tamil vs. Hindi. i.e. how many people will watch both versions? Probably small population. So this is quite easily one film really and should be treated as such due to hardly any overlapping business.
So at least 100Cr net I would guess or more from India to break even or maybe even 125Cr.
Now I am not into the price of a movie to judge its verdict. I am just purely talking economics here and not verdicts. How probable is a film to make 100Cr+++++ net across India? Unless your Aamir, no one has done it.
Some of the deals struck are very illogical and obviously some distributors have more money then they want!
They advertise so much, but not taken care of simplest things:
1) What kind of poster is that? Everywhere same? How does it craete interest?
2)same Thode song in every channel. Not much of other songs.
3) over usage of faces ->
Ted, when a film fails (or in this case seems to be failing) we sometimes forget the basics. See my note above. It is Raavan that is Rathnam’s pattern, not Guru! Note how I never predicted anything for Raavan the way I did for Guru. Also note that I saw it as being either a very big success or a big failure and not in between. I was obviously hoping for the best but I always had that Rathnam history in mind. If Abhishek were to do another film with Rathnam tomorrow and if it were a less ambitious work I’d predict big things once again. If it were a more ‘interesting’ work I’d again say the very same thing. People who know their Rathnam forget the history. Of course most of the reviewers and others have probably not see more than just Hindi Rathnam.
Also we must get away from the media hysteria. Guru dutt did not make bad films because the media in his generation thought he did. Commercial filmmaking is always tricky when a director goes out of the audience’s comfort zones and Rathnam does that regularly. But he wouldn’t have his prestige if he didn’t. And the Western reviewers (who have reviewed this seriously unlike Kites and many other ‘Bollywood’ films which are reviewed with a condescension) have appreciated it quite a film. Many reviews are superlative.
It is deeply disappointing to see what’s happened. I don’t disagree with Rajen. But let’s not make the film’s quality a function of its box office. And I’m not afraid to say a film is a disaster when I feel it’s one (Drona for example). But all the review attention actually convinces me that Rathnam has made a fine film here.
Satyam, I am disappointed with Abhishek’s characterization than box office failure. (haven’t seen the movie yet, sensed from the trailors itself). Suhasin once commented that Mani’s films miss box office.
Filled with rich colours and lively action, Mani Ratnam’s classically themed epic “Raavan” brings together the mythology of Indian culture and the flair and fun of Bollywood with tremendous flourish.
Cinematographers Manikandan and Santosh Sivan with production designer Samir Chanda and editor A. Sreekar Prasad serve Ratnam superbly with images, settings and vitality that take one’s breath away.
Success is inevitable throughout India and with expat audiences. Such is the flare of the filmmaking that international audiences also can be expected to respond positively. The 130-minute film opens Friday in Britain.
The story is drawn from the legend of Ramayana, Raavan, a 10-headed demon-god who kidnaps Sita, the wife of Lord Rama. He must hack off all those heads in order to recover his beloved. Top Bollywood actress Aishwarya Rai plays Ragini, the ravishing wife of a police inspector she calls Dev. He is played by the actor Vikram, who has moved to take over policing a remote part of Northern India filled with jungles, ravines, imposing cliffs and waterfalls. Abhishek Bachchan (Rai’s real-life husband) plays Beera Munda, a multifaceted character whom some regard as a criminal but others revere as a benefactor.
When Beera’s family is brutally victimized by the police during a wedding, he retaliates by kidnapping Ragini and taking her deep into the mountainous outback. Dev sets out with his men to bring her back.
Shot in two versions in the Hindi and Tamil languages — the Hindi version will play in most international territories — the film mixes styles with great invention so that the drama is filled with intensity. There also are dynamic musical sequences enhanced by the irresistible music of A. R. Rahman, Oscar-winning composer of the “Slumdog Millionaire” score. These musical sequences include a splashing war dance at a jungle temple, a romantic portrait of domestic bliss and a celebration of impending nuptials; the choreography is as bold and striking as the music.
Vikram cuts a strong figure as the police officer, though in his dark glasses, he often resembles a sinister hard man from a film about a South American dictator. Bachchan has fun with a character who is fierce, passionate and dangerous but also comic in his self-doubt over whether to kill his captive or make love to her. As for Rai, the camera adores her just as it loves the mist on the river, the rainfall in the jungle and the white water surging over rocky cliffs. She, too, is a force of nature. The film makes the most of it.
“Success is inevitable throughout India and with expat audiences. Such is the flare of the filmmaking that international audiences also can be expected to respond positively. ”
this is very disappointing as to what has happened here!! i had high hopes from this one..nd i dont know..maybe i will like the movie once i watch it..(yes..i haven’twatched it still!!)..
but the bad thing is that its neither being appreciated critically nd not doing that well commercially as well..except the camerawork..nothing is being praised..yes..absolutely NOTHING!!
as an abhi fan..must say ..its a very very SAD day today!! nd his next is ashutosh’s film for which i dont have any high hopes..looks like a very very dull year for him now..!! i think he seriously has to do some commercial films now…its all very good nd gr8 working with “prestigious” directors (as rajen said)..but i have often seen..that d kinds of films he makes..the scripts he chooses..fails to excite nd enthuse the audience…!! time is running out for him..with every flop movie..u only lose ur credibility..!!
the irony is Abhi has to fall back on Karan Johar or Yashraj to give him a hit…Dostana 2 will be his best bet for a commercial success in future…But the abhi fans will never stop riduculing and criticiing these two production houses who are responsible for keeping abhi’s career afloat…
I know a SRK fan knows all about the irony of falling back on Yashraj or Johar but actually I don’t believe they’ve kept his career afloat.. his single greatest career moment was still in a Rathnam film or for that matter the RGV Sarkar was also important. And if he had a hit with BnB he also had JBJ.
And we keep criticizing those production houses precisely because we are sincere in our beliefs and don’t start loving those films just because Abhishek does them!
Much as I didn’t start disliking Dil Se or going hysterical over it because SRK was in it or because it was a bomb.
Only director Mani Ratnam could have the dexterity to ascribe the story of The Ramayana to a raw, modernist setting and yet remain faithful to the original story. In Ratnam’s version the mythological characters of yore are supplanted with a Police Inspector ‘Dev’ (Vikram) and his wife Ragini’ (Aishwarya Rai Bachchan) who become the prey of the ruthless Beera (Abhishek Bachchan). Injured and enraged, Beera drags both Dev and Ragini into battle through the deepest ravines of the jungle as their wage a war for survival.
Ratnam puts his actors through the mill in a rigorous shoot which sees them braving the elements. Their most physically challenging roles yet, both Aishwarya and Abhishek give their all, delivering passionate performances, albeit at times appearing to run through a stock catalogue of well practiced expressions. The mud ravaged Aishwaryia alternates between deathly mortification, chin wobbling desperation and coy helplessness, all of which work to great effect in rendering the rain soaked damsel ever lovelier as she is sent plummeting down a cliff side and left to claw her way out of any number of pits and ravines. All this and her beauty is never once dimmed.
As the fearful Beera, Abhishek spends a large part of the film snarling at Aishwarya and while he captures the insanity of a vengeful man, his maniacal musings begin to grate, until we realise that his demeanour is symptomatic of the damaged psyche of a man, wounded at his core.
None of the films in 2010 are remarkable accept rajneeti which surprisely did well at the B.O…Even MNIK was below par which only overseas saved it going “dud”…Raavan is heading towards disaster i wonder what next on the list..non of the stars guarantees success accept and yes accept Amir khan who is simply untouchable .If mangal pandey would have realeased today it would have been thumps-up on the opening day…
Ted: agree the Presidency is not determined by a direct election, but then that raises another question: given that the President is elected by legislators, that tweeter is suggesting saying that the aam Indian can’t appreciate him, but that an electorate of professional netas did?! In fact, I would argue the reverse: India’s presidents are generally political insiders (i.e. presidency becomes a reward for serving the party well; e.g. Pratibha Patil); no disrespect is intended, as some have been people of stature (Rajendra Prasad, Zakir Husain, S. Radhakrishnan), BUT Kalam was not a political insider in that sense. The electorate of professional netas brought him in precisely because they thought this choice would go down well with the people. And, it did.
On the issue at hand: If Raavan flops — and it seems likely it will — mujh se zyaada afsoos shaayad hi kisi ko hoga (if the film turns out to be one I like, as has happened with multiple Rathnam films, aur bhi afsoos hoga). But there’s no need to use this as an occasion to throw one’s hands up and piss on one’s own people (not suggesting you are saying that ted, referring to the tweeple here). IF Raavan is a good film that isn’t getting its audience, then we (the industry; the critics; people who write and talk about films) all need to do a better job of promoting the kind of cinema we think should be there; certainly the audience isn’t above critique, but bringing up the category “India”/its politics/Mayawati/society-at-large is just uncalled for.
A lot of presidents (I think) only serve one term. Second, and more important, Kalam was widely perceived to be closer to the BJP — hence when the Congress took over they were NOT keen on having him, and he chose not to fight a battle he couldn’t have won (i.e. by the time of his 2nd term, the electoral arithmetic was against him). The presidency is largely ceremonial, BUT it fulfils certain crucial functions (dismissing state governments, imposing governor’s rule, etc.) so ruling parties would always like “their people” in that position…
Q- aap tau united India- pakistan ke President banoge. LOL
PS- read your article on your blog, about India Pakistan in a hurry, was very very well written and will read it again to fully understand.
It’s admirable that Abhishek is not afraid of doing risky stuff but without Aamir’s script sense, he is more likely to fail than succeed. Examples: D6, JBJ, Drona and now Raavan.
BTW I wasn’t surprised when Aamir dropped out of Lajjo, his idea of cinema is very different from Rathnam’s.
^Ditto. The Indian critics also over exaggerated over how supposedly bad Sarkar Raj and Delhi 6 were as movies as well. The way the critics carried on you would have thought these movies were the worst to ever be made. I went on my own to watch Sarkar Raj and Delhi 6. I found both movies flawed, but very enjoyable to watch. I enjoyed them. The venom the critics spewed did not match up because both movies were very good in my view.
I agree completely.. it is not as simple as the orthodoxy would have one believe! The thing is Rocky there is a ‘faith’ one can follow as it is passed down to one which then becomes no more than the power of an existing orthodoxy. But then there is another kind where one questions it, and probes it for all its ambiguities.. I think this approach enriches one.. otherwise one is like the Islamists (and not only these) who lose their religion at the drop of a hat. So the Agnipariksha ought to be deeply problematic. This does not make the Ramayana a lesser work. If anything given the richness of the tradition that gives to us this canonical Ramayana (always inflected through a Brahmin prism.. one forgets this at one’s peril) why should one be so fixated on just one version? I am enamored by the sheer inventiveness of so many of these texts (not just the Ramayana) whenever I approach them. Why be reductive? Why just follow an orthodoxy? and if one is going to do this why blame anyone else for being as inflexible? Fundamentalism arises precisely because of such monomanias. Let’s not be afraid of debate. I am not saying all of this to you necessarily, you’re an old ‘partner-in-crime’ in these matters, and one whose comments I’ve always enjoyed, but as a general matter let’s not be offended so easily! I think getting back to the film that if the polygraph disturbs anyone Rathnam has precisely hit his mark. Sometimes the truth of a work lies in its rejection. I turn away from certain kinds of violence on screen. What scares me is precisely the fact that it does in fact exist.
Satyam, it is said that the two flaws Ram in otherwise purushotam Ram were Killing of Bali and Agnee Parikhsha.
but if you listen to the various Ram Katha Vachaks they have a whole set of reasons for these acts.
anyways I am not doubting Rathnam’s right to present it any which way he likes , I personally shall not agree if it has been travalized.
I understand that some are feeling let down. No one wants to see their fave actor’s movie fail. But if Abhishek had turned down Raavan then he would have been crucified by the media and fans for turning down a Mani Rathnam movie. However why would Abhishek turn down a movie with Rathnam? Mani Rathnam is one of India’s best directors. Rathnam has given Abhishek 2 of his most rich and iconic roles in Yuva and Guru. Yuva and Guru changed Abhishek’s career for the better. So it was a no brainer that Abhishek would eagerly want to sign up for Raavan.
So I don’t see anything out or order in Abhishek’s choice to sign up for Raavan. At the end of the day I think Raavan will become one of his signature movies no matter its box office fate. Raavan’s box office fate was never in Abhishek’s control as he had no control over the movie’s writing, production, or directing. If Raavan fails at the box office then it will be because the screenplay and the movie in general failed to click with the mass audience. It would be unfortunate, but is what it is.
I do agree with the general consensus that Abhishek must be admired for having the courage to do risky movies like JBJ, Delhi 6, and Raavan since audiences in India don’t cotton to these type of movies which are surreal, complex, and go against the grain of the Indian sensibilities. For those who say that Abhishek should be more careful in regards to his career. I’m in agreement with that sentiment only on the grounds that he needs to vastly improve his script sense. Abhishek needs to have a better handle on what will work for the mass audience in India. But so does most actors in Bollywood. It took Aamir Khan many years before he developed great script sense through trial and error.
As far as Abhishek’s current line up of movies(Game, Dum Maaro Dum, KHJJS, Dostana 2, Italian Job, Special Chabbis, etc.). I don’t have any real quibbles with his choices as he is trying to mix it up with a variety of roles and genres. In fact I think the majority of Abhishek’s upcoming movies will fare vastly well at the box office since the majority of these movies are commercial in nature with low to medium sized budgets. I think this will benefit and work for Abhishek. However I still hope that if presented with future opportunities that Abhishek will continue to work with Rathnam, Mehra, Gowariker, etc. I think Abhishek does suits quality cinema and it helps him row as an actor. I hope to see Abhishek balance good commercial cinema with quality(meaningful)cinema. Whatever the fate of Raavan. Abhishek can’t be counted out. Abhishek is a vastly good actor. He still has great potential. I still see much acclaim and success in Abhishek’s future. I’m also still eager and excited to go out to watch Raavan. I’m sure I’ll enjoy Raavan the same way I enjoyed Abhishek’s other current movies: Sarkar Raj, Dostana , Delhi 6. and Paa.
ps. satyam I was finally able to get my message through to post today. lol
Agreed.
I think Abhishek has done great roles and films which might not have clicked.
And please stop bringing Amir into every thing.
He’s 45/46 for crying out loud. After several failures he reached where he is now.
ABjr should carry on in this vein and he’ll definitely make a mark.
What can one say when Housefull is liked and Raavan not.
I was not bringing up Aamir as an insult or anything of real relevance. I was just using him as one quick example of how long it takes for actors to learn to recognise what the audience wants and what works for them. I do hope Abhishek improves on this front. But I’m in agreement with you that Abhishek should continue on with mixing it up in his career as it will lead to him making a more consistent mark as an actor. I don’t see much fault with his current line up.
Dil Se should have worked? Why? There was no soul in the movie. Swades, a different thing altogether, I could feel the emotions. No way Dil Se was convincing at all. It was a major disappointment from Mani Ratnam.
There was no audience connect. No basis as to why he leaves a bubbly Preuty Zinta for a very indifferent Manisha Koirala. Sorry it was the biggest disappointment for me. I have no problems with radical script and it’s treatment. Bottomline, it lacked a soul for me and all people who rejected it.
He’s always shown as a somewhat strange guy who’s quite enraptured with Manisha as this woman of mystery. It’s a rather old trope in many ways. And he doesn’t leave Zinta because he’s never interested in her. He has Manisha on the mind.
– the burden of the leading star did in Dil Se, as everyone expected an SRK starrer to be a “romantic” movie like his other famous ones, a la DDLJ, KKHH, DTPH.
– the above also ties in to the importance of proper marketing, which is very hard in India, where most films are sold, and the audience makes its viewing decision, based on the stars involved, not reviews or marketing (a good example is KANK — many people went in thinking, Oh, SRK-Rani in a KJo movie — will be a great romance.)
– if you want to be experimental, better to be so with unknown actors, who don’t have the baggage of their screen image (which they have to carefully nurture to survive or succeed in the industry). If you want the added commercial viability of having “stars”, then you have to tailor the film to their marketable strengths, and be less “experimental.”
– a film that delivers on what it promises (Housefull) maybe considered to be more “honest” than one which doesn’t (Kites; perhaps Raavan)
– different audiences have different sensibilities. Popular works, in any medium, are more accessible to a wider variety of people than those requiring more education or experience. But this does not necessarily mean that the popular work has to be denigrated, as it is still giving a lot of people something that they want.
The bottom line to me is, if you’re working in mass communications (as writers and filmmakers undoubtedly are), you must take the responsibility if you fail to communicate with the masses, and not blame them for being “unworthy” of your genius.
For me personally, if the only USP of Raavan is that it shows Sita to fall in love with Raavan, or shows that Ram isn’t perfect, it will only produce a big yawn from me. This “revision” has been done too many times in Telugu literature for it to hold any novelty for me.
SM, using that standard of mass communication we would have been deprived of several fine or very good films all over the globe. I am always thankful that some in every age risk the box office.
On the Ramayana bit not sure what relevance Telugu literature has to a film form as masterful as Rathnam’s, specially here?! Also by that standard what theme do you find in any other film that you watch that you have never encountered in literature?! I am expecting a subversion of the Ramayana not a canonical take on this epic that could rival that of a great novel? Isn’t this a straw man?! But again Rathnam’s film form should entice if nothing else.
Anyway I’m leaving for the film, will pick this up later..
Why would we be deprived of fine films? I am only saying that there is no need to wonder why they were not accessible to a larger audience, and conversely, that there is no need to look down on a film that does connect to a larger audience. So there is no need to frame a question like, “What does it mean when Housefull works and Dil Se doesn’t?” in any but financial terms, since the very word “works” only refers to the box office. One may equally well ask, “What does it mean when Housefull works and KI doesn’t?” The difference is pricing and cost, and people have learned that lesson, hence the reason why Housefull “works”, without being in any way different artistically. So what it “means” in the Dil Se context is, as I have said above, that a filmmaker making an offbeat film should handle the finances accordingly, and believe that the presence of a star is enough to compensate, if the film doesn’t fit the star’s market strengths.
As for the reference to Telugu literature, I said that was my personal take. Someone for whom that idea is fresh or new may take more away from the film than I would, since for me the idea itself would be already somewhat hackneyed.
I actually look down on a critical apparatus (to dignify it greatly) that judges Dil Se and Housefull using the very same yardstick. And I have never confused art with democracy. You are certainly right about the financial side of things but what does one do of the subject and formal vision of a filmmaker require the film to be made on a certain scale. What if someone told Orson Welles not to spend tons of money on Citizen Kane and make it on a shoestring budget? A box office failure in its time, now judged the greatest film of all time by many! Hitchcock’s Vertigo was also a bit of a damp squib at the time, today another ‘greatest’ kind of film. What am I getting at? Not that every box office failure can be so rescued but without the right critical tools one is totally at sea anyway. It is always hard to predict what will stand the test of time or reinvented in another age but whatever the age Dil Se has a lot better chance than Housefull.
I understood what you meant, I just don’t find the Telugu literature example valid. For one cinema offers audio-visual pleasures that are other to those of literature. But secondly I could pretty much dismiss every film ever made in every industry of the world using the argument that it is not ‘ahead’ of literature with your very criterion. I am not exaggerating at all. here’s an example — there’s nothing Bergman does that you couldn’t get out of Strindberg or Kierkegaard. There’s nothing Fellini does that couldn’t be derived from Fellini. There’s nothing in Antonioni that couldn’t be extracted from a host of European novelists. On and on. In other words one wouldn’t need cinema at all! What about the visual grammar the medium offers? It’s not just that a story is being told by way of visuals, it is assuredly, in most instances anyway, but the fact that we ‘receive’ the same differently when we read as opposed to when we view it. The Greeks used the same myths hundreds of times in their drama. Just those little twists they brought about mattered. No one expected them to offer enormously important alternate takes on those myths everytime they attempted these!
As for the negative reviews most people actually haven’t discussed the Ramayana at all, they’ve simply dismissed the film.
Eire,
You are right and Raavan is a very good project, atleast on paper.
It SEEMS to have gone wrong somewhere in execution. Having not seen the film, ideally should not be commenting on it. But, have heard enough opinions to atleast appreciate the film has not succeded in having a large section of public and critics into ‘buying into’ the film. It might still please some but leave a large majority feeling ‘unfulfilled’ and that would be a failure of sorts. At this stage of his career Abhi can ill afford these high profile failures.
Just gauging the reviews it seems that the execution of Raavan failed to click with the mass audience because of the screenplay and the pace wee the movie’s undoing. That is the gist that has been written. I will see the movie for myself to suss it out. Though I have enjoyed all of Rathnam’s Hindi movies(and even some of his Tamil movies). So I’m sure I’ll enjoy Raavan. It’s true that no actor needs high profile failures. But I indeed believe that Abhishek will survive all of this as he has done in the past. I have no doubts. If other actors are currently surviving high profile failures then there is no reason to think any different with Abhishek. I don’t see much alarm or much to worry about with his line up at this juncture.
I personally think Eire the problems with this are all ideological.. I just heard from someone whose opinion I have great respect for that this is a very fine film but equally a very subversive one..
You keep bringing up this “ideological” charge. I am not sure to what you are referring. Are you referring to a different take on the Ramayana, or to film industry politics regarding Mani Ratnam? If it is the former, anything that seeks to be subversive needs to lay a proper groundwork for that subversion. It is not enough to present a different interpretation merely for the sake of difference. Consider this: If this film were called something other than “Raavan”, would it have fared any better? If not (because of the pacing, weak storyline and weak performances, as several reviews have mentioned), then the problem cannot be ideological, but rests with the quality of the film itself.
The fact that the Tamil version is also facing the same kind of criticisms, to my mind shows that the problems are with the film as a film, not with its ideology. (We had discussed long before the release about how the alternate Ramayana tradition in Tamil Nadu might work in the film’s favor, while it might be more problematic in Hindi.)
I am referring to the fact (as always) that Hindi multiplex audiences are not kind on a film that subverts their ‘values’ or ‘lifestyle choices’. The Ramayana is not the issue here. It is what Rathnam does in most of his films to the whole ‘institution’ of middle class mores.
On the reviews I could point to tons of important films from all over the world including India that were also dismissed by the critics. Doesn’t necessarily prove as much. Mera Naam Joker is today RK’s biggest moneyspinner, bigger than all of his other hits in reruns. But at the time it was mauled so savagely and was such a flop that in some ways Raj Kapoor never quite recovered from the setback. Failures drove Guru Dutt to suicide and today many of his films are considered among the very greatest.
Also I’m not sure about you but I wasn’t expecting an interpretation here to parallel the Kamban Ramayana!
Finally, in my view certain kinds of films are represented as ‘boring’, ‘weak in script’ etc etc precisely when people find it hard to absorb them for other reasons. Meanwhile dozens of films that become hits with garbage scripts and equally poor performances are never called up for the same reason. Ideology is what veils itself. I have seen very many serious efforts that do not work being criticized on these seemingly ‘neutral’ grounds.
Fair review, I would say. I think there is a common theme running thru most negative and even some positive reviews. Beera’s character has gone somewhere wrong in conception and execution.
All this once again brings the question of BO economics vis-a-vis mainstream-vs-offbeat movies. If a director knows that the movie is not mainstream, why spend so much and ruin the star’s saleability for future projects. In 6 weeks, we have seen 3 movies which were all offbeats. I wont call Kites mainstream, just cause RR took the whole language risk, as well as taking a foreign heroine for the whole movie, etc.
Pricing/Cost for both Kites and Raavan has definitely not been sensibly calibrated. Rajneeti on the other hand with a large canvas of stars, was priced right. Even if it had not clicked massively, it still wudve recovered the costs and the actors wudve been spared.
Ranbir must be smiling (or blowing smokerings) after looking at the fate of Kites/Raavan.
Abhishek Bachchan, best known for Michael Douglas-style urbane cosmopolitans in bespoke suits, but who, as the charismatic and possibly sociopathic tribal leader Beera, plays a manic-depressive Col. Kurtz who hears voices and has to hit himself in the head to try to oust them. As undeniably talented as Michael Douglas is, it’s hard to picture him nailing this difficult, teetering-on-outré role, which only works if the demon is confident and conflicted simultaneously, and recognizably human without the actor beating his chest about it. This may be Bachchan’s most accomplished performance to date.
the idea that everyone has disliked the performance is myth. But what happens unfortunately is that once there’s enough negativity and a certain hysteria is generated people start overlooking the other kind of review.
i don’t know which world you folks are living in, but the movie is getting pure bad reviews and WOM. Even Hrithik fans can pull off a few reviews/tweets from the internet to show Kites is extremely liked. It won’t make it the truth. These reviews are one in a hundred kind of deal, and pretty sure it will take few hours to dig a positive one from the internet. Appreciate how hard ppl on this forum are trying to do some damage control, but in vain.
another chance for getting a solo hit for abhi seems to go down the drain.
Mani ratnam is no doubt a great director but mostly with regional cinema. if he needs to get a film successful at an all india level, he needs to move out of his comfort mode (more or less every film of his is inclined to a heavy south indian touch). all his hindi films except Guru have failed at the indian box office.
It has nothing to do with ‘regional’. Many of his high profile Tamil films have also failed. Not sure why this point is so hard to register for most people despite endless repetition. Is it necessary to dismiss him as the ‘regional’ guy? Rathnam has done better in HIndi than Bhardwaj. How come no one calls the latter ‘regional’?
Guys can we stop with the elities attitude. Just because the public doesnt like what you and I may prefer that doesnt mean that they are some how making the wrong choice or that they are stupid. The audience likes what the audience likes and everyone should respect that. The same public loved 3I and other “good” films.
I feel bad for Abhi because I feel he is a talented guy, but I too fear that he starting to run out chances. Working with “prestigous” directors is fine but at some point you have too deliver a boxoffice hit. If he can’t deliver a hit soon I still think he will have a long career but maybe along the lines of a Shashi Kapoor as a second hero.
Yes, Abhishek and other actors should deliver hits. But no actor of any caliber can make a movie a hit if the movie fails to click or work with the mass audience. An actor can deliver a great opening for a movie but if the movie does not click with the audience then its going to quickly fizzle out. We have seen this happen many times to other actors last year and this year!
just watched raavan…..oh man !!!! paisa vasool !!!!
went with low expectation after such tepid reviews. But to the contrary a very fine movie. Excellent performance from Abhi, Ash and vikram. Govinda & Nikhil surprises. But Priaymani with a very short appearence put a long lasting mark. She was so beautiful & charmings a village belle. Excellent BGM and Cinematography. I have never seen such great visuals in a bollywood movie ever. First half was good but second just brilliant with a great climax. honestly i enjoyed this movie more that Dil se, Yuva and Guru. Details review later…
and please for god sake dont pay obituary for a movie without even seeing it. I just loved it and all my friends also enjoyed immensely. evening show had 90% occupancy in NCR
I went to Satyam, chennai. hindi is allocated 3 shows. Got the ticket only previous day. Tamil was houseful. Most of the audience got tired of the film & his performance. Started making catcalls & funny jokes on him.
i am an aamir fan. Honestly i enjoyed the movie and not just any particular actor/actress. Abhishek should be lauded for taking a bold step and doing this kind of cinema. * Spoler alert* Ironically the ending is similar to Kites but the impact is 100 times better than kites. Audience was spellbound when abhi fell from the cliff and the same audience were laughing when HR jumped at the end in Kites.
Bachans are not afraid to try different and rishky but all we hear from srk fans is abhi did this and that where as srk specialty is to do remake of devdas or don or doing romantis triangle like KHNH…atleast abhi is doing rishky project….grow-up.
desparate times takes desperate measures and does happen to any stars…one day it will happen to srk when he will do a remake of black or paa and wrongly back-fires……..
May be it is only me or is there something wrong with the reviews? I just saw this film in London and not only I liked the film, I saw positive reaction from fellow watchers as well. And hall was 80% full. What’s going on………..
Saw raavan first day first show in my city with family …. that too after taking few hours off from work, that tells how much i love to see abhi on screen.
I went to the movie after reading almost all published reviews with zero expectations and the movie did not disappoint me at all. I just loved all lead actors performances and abhi is excellent as beera.
In spite of great performances from all actors, great music and great visuals somehow mani couldn’t package it well. I think may be mani should have developed the ram-sita story in the beginning and told the story in a linear fashion with kidnapping at the interval. Just a thought.
I am planning to watch ‘omrao jaan tonight, that is the only abhi movie I haven’t seen yet. yep, thats right I have seen everything else!!!!!
Well, I actually don’t mind him much as an actor. He’s fairly likeable in many films I have watched of his.
but the truth is he gained a soft corner in the hearts of many people who had sympathy for him after so many flops he delivered early in his career, that they were waiting desperately for any kind of success for him. it all started with Yuva where he was critically appreciated by many critics.. and all hell broke loose for these guys who were favouring this underdog.. so much that he became an instant favourite with some.. and with few successes in 2005, media started comparing him with Amitabh bachchan’s earliest phase in career.. Yuva was even compared with Amitabh’s Zanjeer.
but whatever happened after that proved it was too soon to call abhi a star.. coz apart from Guru and a couple of other multi starrer hits, Abhi never delieverd anything substantial.. maybe the big projects he was involved with didnt deliver good films but then it affected him the most.
so its just not wise to have high expectations from this guy. he can deliver once in a while and than can satisfy people who have no hopes from him
chetan_bhagat Some visuals are truly world class. Performances good. Given the ambitious nature, some portions may jar to typical bollywood fare seekers.
chetan_bhagat But overall Mani is a genius. I liked it more than Guru, but that’s just me. And yeah, nobody told me to write this.
chetan_bhagat And I find shooting star anchor hunt too much, Raavan team must have killed themselves shooting this. Well done all! Gnite!
From all the reviews it definitely seems that the film is pitched far more to western sensibilities of movie making than those of Indian and it’s probably to be expected with such a short running time for such an inate subject to the Indian mindset. Western audiences and reviewers don’t know the different versions of the mythology and are also used to joining the dots where story weaving comes into play. Infact it might do better with non Indian viewers who just see a kidnap thriller in a rustic settings.
As for the review Abhishek’s getting I tend to expect them as I’ve said before he’s like marmite you either love him or hate him acting wise especially if your a big fan of the theatrical performances of Bwood cinema. The tone of his performances will always throw people. I think by going by all the reviews I’m going to love the film and the performances.
Ju..st enjoyed watching raavan and ash was fabulos and mani has provided an memoriable epic…here in birminghampeople were revving after the film and fact is it was packed screen.just luved it man
my message to people is….just go n watch——–Raavan!
However the film is not bad as portrayed by most of the media, news channels and honorary critics. The film is definitely worth a watch. I do not know what were the critics expecting from this movie but if anyone had to make a different adaptation of Ramayana, this was the way to do it. Else Barjatyas adapted Ramayana for Hum Sath Sath Hain and so did Ramanand Sagar for TV and Manoj Kumar for his Kalyug aur Ramayan. I think Mani Ratnam has taken a brave step especially by showing the ending shot when Sita screams for the dying Raavan.
Box Office: Raavan opening day collections below expectation
HETAL ADESARA 19 June , 2010
MUMBAI: Mani Ratnam’s Raavan has had a poor opening day at the box office. The movie was released in three versions – Hindi (Raavan), Tamil (Raavanan) and Telugu (Villain). The Hindi version of the movie has done net collections of Rs 55 million (Rs 5.50 crore) on day one across India.
The Friday morning and afternoon shows had a poor response with average occupancy levels ranging between 20 – 40 per cent in smaller centers and around 40 – 60 per cent in centers like Mumbai and Pune.
As compared to the opening day collections of recent films like Raajneeti, Kites and Housefull, Raavan has proved to be a damp squib for the industry. While Raajneeti’s opening day net collections were Rs 105 million, Kites’ was Rs 104 million and that of Housefull was Rs 90 million.
It now remains to be seen how this Abhishek Bachchan – Aishwarya Rai Bachchan starrer holds fort at the box office during the weekend.
“It’s tempting to think what a better actress, one less prone to dainty posturing, might have accomplished with this character, but Aishwarya, to her credit, at least, doesn’t frustrate you to the extent that her real-life husband does. The most baffling aspect of Raavan is Abhishek Bachchan’s embodiment of the eponymous villain. He has a superb scene where, after letting Ragini go in a fit of weakness, he imagines her in his clutches again and shoots at her, just to prove to himself that he’s still got his edge. He’s as still as death, his face a stony mask. The effect is chilling.
But elsewhere? Imagine Toshiri Mifune in a Noh-styled Kurosawa drama imbued with the gesticulations of a silent-film scoundrel, and hissing like a rattlesnake making furious love to a tambourine – and you have the general idea. (Bachchan’s scenes are often shot with a jittery camera, possibly to highlight how unhinged he is, but this only accentuates how off-putting the performance is.) If the attempt was to be crowd-pleasing in the mythical (or even masala) sense while staying true to character, he might have looked closer at costar Ravi Kishan, who plays Beera’s loyal brother. The latter, with half the effort, achieves twice the effect.”
Saturday 19th June 2010 14.30 IST
Boxofficeindia.Com Trade Network
The Hindi version Raavan collected around 5.75 crore nett on day one. Business in all circuits was pretty low. The film was helped a bit by some upper end multiplexes where the volume of screenings was heavy but most of India recorded dull collections. Gujarat, UP, Bihar, CP Berar, CI and Rajasthan had poor collections.
The South was comparatively better in terms of occupancies but there overall collections were affected by the regional versions of Raavan which meant the audience had a choice as to which version to watch.
The negative reports are likely to mean big falls on Monday. There may even be a drop on Saturday with even Sunday not likely show a big jump which happens with most films. The weekend numbers should come in the 16-17 crore nett range. Overall the film may not even cross the 15 crore distributor share in its whole run.
June 19, 2010 07:08:18 PM IST
Bollywood Trade News Network
Reliance BIG Pictures and Madras Talkies’ RAAVAN seems to have got an excellent opening at the box office. It has grossed Rs 20 crores worldwide on the opening day from its three versions- Hindi (RAAVAN), Tamil (RAAVANAN) and Telugu (VILLAIN).
RAAVAN is India’s first film to have released worldwide in Hindi, Tamil and Telugu language simultaneously.
The film has opened in 2200 screens worldwide on 18th June in all its three versions.
Directed by Mani Ratnam, the film is a modern-day version and a loose adaptation of the Indian epic Ramayana, in which Sita, the wife of Lord Rama, was abducted by the demon (Rakshasa) king of Lanka, Ravana. The film’s score and soundtrack is composed by A. R. Rahman.
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From Time Out London
India’s most intelligent and respected director, Tamilian Ratnam’s latest bilingual (Hindi/Tamil) film is solid and superior Bollywood entertainment. The bastard Beera (Bachchan) kidnaps the ‘arrogant and fearless’ Ragini (Rai-Bachchan), wife of no-nonsense cop Dev (Vikram). On one level, the plot is dosa-thin: will Dev rescue Ragini safely? But this is a modern update on the revered Hindu epic Sanskrit text ‘The Ramayana’ (c.300 BC). Ratnam’s characterisation kicks in after the first ‘chase and thrills’ hour, giving us a feisty female protagonist who has to question her perception of her captor as either ‘raavan (demon) or Robin Hood’. Performances attract admiration, Oscar-winner A R Rahman’s energetic rustic tunes charm and the cinematography of a monsoonal rural India is stunning. Unlike its mythological evil namesake, this ‘Raavan’ is ravishingly good.
Author: Anil Sinanan 2010-06-18 10:59:05
Time Out London Issue 2078: 17 – 23 June, 2010
Looks like this film will be a success in overseas,,,
1)A film’s worth is not just reducible to the box office or its initial reviews. If you do not think this self-evident I really believe you need greater exposure to the medium and its history.
2)Whatever I believe about Abhishek no one has to buy it. You are quite free to consider me deluded on this matter also. Perhaps I just have terrible taste that I consider Abhishek a good actor or a star with great screen presence.
But your going after me (or others) again and again won’t change anyone’s opinion. For years I went through a blog where then were a dozen like you attacking every single word I said on Abhishek. So bullying me into shutting up is, safe to say, not an option! I don’t really see the point of continuing in this direction. You can put up all the reviews that rip Abhishek, all the box office reports that fairly or unfairly ridicule its box office performance, but you don’t have to become a Nazi who cannot tolerate the slightest dissent on this matter!
Rangan’s review on the film is the classic example of everything criticism ought to be and this also neatly dovetails with my overall point here. He too has not liked the film, he too has disliked Abhishek in it but consider how well done his piece is in grappling with what the film is about.
The rest is grade 2 name-calling stuff. I refer here to some of the other comments also.
I made a bit of an overstatement there.. didn’t mean he was dismissing the movie or anything, just that he was ‘mixed’ on many aspects of it.. surprised with the 4 star rating but it’s clear that I misread where he was coming from.. he does mean to endorse the film..
This was already posted in the other thread — he has mauled the abhi and ash performances, but it is clear from the review that he thinks quite highly of the film…
tyler….I think u have forgotten that this is the same joke mr.satyam was living on whenever one used to bring MNIK overseas collection into discussion.
all said and done MNIK is the biggest grosser overseas and raavan is heading towards a big failure based on initial figures.
Not that I expect honesty from folks like yourself but that is a gross misrepresentation of my position.. incidentally I haven’t introduced overseas numbers here either.. but yeah I doubt I will be talking about Indonesia week 8 and Syria week 7.
Incidentally I think I gave one of the better reviews to MNIK but hey let’s not confuse anyone with the facts!
Vijay, let me give you my honest perspective of Raavan overseas BO
1. It is NOT going to crossover by any stretch of imagination.
2. It is NOT going to succeed with the Indian diaspora as it is not a NRI movie
if people still keep saying it is going to do well overseas, I just give my POV. I used similar words that Satyam used to use for MNIK. Nothing wrong with it.
Satyam, I do not agree that you have not mocked MNIK overseas collections in a similar way to what I did.
Also, please note any name calling was never initiated by me. I am surprised you did not protest when I was at the receiving end. Is it because I am not optimistic about Raavan as much as others are?
Let me also tell you I am very neutral on my views of Abhishek Bachchan. I loved Bluffmaster as compared to Guru or Dostana. I consider Yuva Abhi’s best performance till date, though I did not like the movie that much. But it is just that I find commentary on Abhi on this site totally biased.
Here’s what you said Satyam. If that ain’t mocking, nothing is.
“Shezad, keep me posted on Indonesia week 16 and Egypt week 31 for MNIK. But internationally the Avatar record is in danger. No doubt about it. The 3I comparison is foolish anyway. Who looks at the Indian gross? Holland week 42 is what I’m interested in.”
yes but you haven’t looked at the overall context.. when the film didn’t do well in India some of the SRK fans went on a tear looking for every last penny of overseas gross.. the gross was good enough on its own but clearly there was some Aamir anxiety here coupled with the desire to have the Indian deficit made up by the overseas one.. not sure what’s so hard to understand here.. it is not at all comparable to many of your statements where you’re more or less attacking people for being optimistic about the box office at any level or having a good word to say about the movie!
not for me evidently.. I might take Abhishek over Aamir also as a star-actor.. I would take Abhishek over Amitabh in certain situations.. everything is debatable.. so why are you trying to shut it off?
Also, I have a feeling you are unable to distinguish between screen presence and acting. Rajkumar had a great screen presence, but was a non actor. Abhishek has a great screen presence, but is not a brilliant actor made out to be. Aamir does not have a great screen presence.
Screen presence is something someone is born with, cannot work hard to develop screen presence. A husky voice definitely helps.
i’m not even a fan of abhishek, but i have enough gray matter to know he’s leagues ahead of hrithik as an actor. people have to know that by now. forget debatable, its as unequivocally clear as night follows day, IMO. just take a look at the body of work by both actors. abhishek has given great performances in “yuva”, guru”, “sarkar” and sarkar raj”.
hrithik obviously CAN act, but as an actor, i find him quite overrated. yeah, he’s gorgeous and is much more commercially viable than abhishek. but let’s take a look at his performances, shall we?: ok, he was excellent in “jodhaa-akbar”. i’ll give him that. i’ll be magnanimous in saying that he was really good in “koi mil gaya” as well. but what else? nothing much, really.
if you add his performances in “lakshya”, “mission kashmir”, “fiza”, etc, then ALL bets are off. i’ll just go ahead and include abhishek’s performances in “bluffmaster”, “delhi-6″, “paa”, “umrao jaan”, “bunty aur babli”, etc. forget about box-office, there is NO question who’s the superior, more versatile actor.
I didn’t know that Dilse was flop until few days back. If I have name some of the SRK movies Swadesh, Dilse tops though they are flops.
I can’t even remember any of Akshay Kuamar’s except khakee though he is giving so many hits.
But for Abhishek most of his movies after Yuva are different, long lasting.. I liked his JBJ also
“forget debatable, its as unequivocally clear as night follows day, IMO”
how can it be unequivocal when it is just your opinion? That is the problem I have with the commentary here on SS. It is highly debatable, else we would not be debating it. I don’t rate Abhi’s performance in Guru as highly as you do. Neither has Hrithik done anything pathbreaking in his career s far. It is very debatable as to who is a better actor and it cannot just be opinion of one person or group.
Its so amazing that the indian medei are slautering raavan while there counter-part america and uk media are loving the movie.
The Los Angeles Times described Raavan as an entertainer. “Raavan has Bollywood glamour aplenty, with the lovely if occasionally dramatically challenged Aishwarya Bachchan, Mr. Bachchan’s wife, playing the Sita stand-in. The real star, though, is Mr. Ratnam, a talented visual storyteller who directs action crisply and fills the screen with striking images,” it reported.
The praises don’t end there. Praising the film and its maker Mani Ratnam, Variety reported, “A cop and self-styled Robin Hood face off in a wild and brawny contest in Mani Ratnam’s bullets-and-dance spectacle Raavan,” adding, “ Fabulous locales and lush surroundings provide a great backdrop, with Ratnam carefully matching the work of two cinematographers, Santosh Sivan and V. Manikandan. Hollywood Reporter also described Raavan as a Pan-Indian saga with epic sweep, intense emotion and gorgeous images.
Well, it will interesting to see how Raavan fairs at the box office, after having received mixed response from Indian media and rave reviews from American media. Watch out for this film featuring Abhishek Bachchan, Aishwarya Bachchan and Vikram!
“Its so amazing that the indian medei are slautering raavan while there counter-part america and uk media are loving the movie.” – but those people went ga-ga over Kites also if i’m not wrong! in any case, despite all the negativities around RAAVAN – i beleive that it is not being slaughtered as mercilessly as kites….
Whatever, I will hopefully be going to watch this one tomorrow – at least for the visuals and cinematography; which looks to be the best since Dil se.. at least thats what even the negative reviews suggest
@satyam
>Rangan’s review on the film is the classic example of everything criticism ought to be and this also neatly dovetails with my overall point here. He too has not liked the film
I did not get that impression at all. He wasn’t impressed with AB’s acting though he mentioned a couple of places where he was actually impressed.
But ‘not liked the film’ is not what I gathered.
There were things he liked and things he didn’t.
To be fair to you, you did have kind words for MNIK when you reviewed it, but not so regarding its BO, where you (and others) were quite harsh, and absolutely rubbished its oversees success.
Is it only in India or is it a worldwide phenomenon that there is such schadenfruede when a film fails.
All the threads here about Raavan are resonating with it.
It was the same with MNIK.
In fact there is no sensible comment from those who didn’t like it. Is there nothing else in the film apart from AB? Their comment starts and ends there.
I’m hoping that this is all a ‘created’ frenzy and when it has died down, when the dust has settled we’ll see that the film picks up.
I stand to correction on the Rangan piece and in fact revisited it..
On MNIK I still consider it’s Indian performance nothing to talk about. The overseas performance I dismissed when it was being used to make up for the former. Not sure what’s so hard to understand about this! if Raavan does nothing in India and a fair bit overseas (though I don’t see this happening either) it will hardly become an overall success! It’s not just about the ‘facts’ but what spin is being put on them. So…
a)MNIK did quite a bit overseas? Yes
b)Because of this the film is an overall success? No
and surely you didn’t miss those ridiculous updates on Bahrain week 6 and Indonesia week 9?!
On Raavan I’d be extremely surprised if the film worked at any level at the box office.
Having liked the combo(Abhi-Mani) not once but twice(Yuva and Guru), the curiosity for Raavan was obvious and it was easily my most awaited movie of the month.
The promotional campaign started little shaky,some of the posters and mannerisms of the Lead were not to my total liking, but eventually the songs picked and things looked fine by the time movie released.
The movie had a Underlying Buzz factor going on for it, as it was going to complete the Troika of Movies between the Director-Actor duo.
For starters, i would not compare the movie much with Ramayan here as even though there are clear references to it, it might call out for an altogether another discussion.
The movie follows the now “in” method of non-linear storyline, which when done well can indeed to wonders.
Movie pretty much starts with the kidnapping of Aishwarya Rai Bachchan(Ragini) by “Beera” Abhishek Bachchan for reasons unknown to us.
Ragini is the wife of town Police Inspector(South Star Vikram).
Sooner than later you start seeing that Beera suffers from some kind of Mental Illness(making weird noises,talking to himself). He takes Ragini to the edge of the cliff over the flowing River and threatens her. In a fit of rage Ragini thinks its better to die herself than being killed by Beera and throws herself off to the River.
Somehow she manages to survive and when Beera goes down to save her, some kind of relationship/friction starts developing between them.
On the other hand, Dev is on the hunt for Beera with his colleagues(with the help “Jungle All Knowing” Sanjeevani, played by Govinda). They go through multiple tricks and plots within the thick jungle in their search of Beera.
Beera and Ragini keep going at each other and some kinds of feelings arise(though hard to decipher), especially when Ragini gets to know the reason for Beera’s Actions(ie Her Husband Dev’s indirect involvement in Beera’s sister’s death).
Rest of the movie deals with how Dev finds Beera, followed by a huge preclimax fight scene on the bridge(Quite well done) and then the extended climax(underwhelming).
There is an intermediate scene between the preclimax and climax , where Dev asks Ragini about her relation with Beera and then goes ahead to ask her to have a polygraphic lie detector test, to justify what she is saying is true(ie she is pure).
Scenes like these seem odd may be because of undercooked Characters. You never get to know the real relation between Dev-Ragini(scenes are less) and also Ragini-Beera track leaves lot to be desired to show some kind of real connect between them.
When the movie ends, there is an lingering feeling that you missed something, even though the Penultimate 20-25 mins has a lot of action going on.(mostly on the right note)
Acting Department:
Abhishek Bachchan : In an Author Backed role, he is the centerpiece in this movie. But unfortunately, somehow this time the connect is missing, the character he is playing is loud and thus needs to be larger than life.His crazy mannerisms remain unexplained throughout the movie(though there was some little inference to maybe he got too affected by his sister’s death). I cant pin down the reason but he just felt “Abhi on Steriods” whenever he went into Beera-mode. Except for the track where his sister gets killed(which infact is the best track probably of the movie, alongwith the Preclimax Brdige fight), i cant say i found his acting Good.
Aishwarya Rai Bachchan: She looked great and for the major part played her role of a stubborn,strong and death fearing/life loving woman to good success. In many scenes she displayed good screen presence. Only in certain scenes,she is not that convincing when she is yelling or crying out for help.
Vikram : Has a Smaller role. Downplays for the most part(vis a vis Beera), is pretty good the Bridge Fight scene.
Govinda : Does ok. Though his intro scene is quite hilarious with him flying and jumping all over the place(defying all laws of gravity).
Visuals : Yes i include the amazing visuals of this movie as one to the characters. The cinematography and the wide scale used by the Director and the team is amazing, and the great thing is all he has used is natural resources – Mountains, cliffs, rivers, waterfalls etc. Its truly a feast for the eyes.
Verdict : The movie is dis-engaging at so many levels, i think it will be hard for most to get engrossed and entertained fully by this Magnum-Opus outing by the duo.
below might change more negative or positive tomorrow when i write something… more detail review.. tomo
one of the greatest cinematic experience killed by abhi… for me.. he not bad.. but problem is hes not great.. in a author backed role.. showing his limitations.. hes is just okayish remniscent of may be drona.. in lacking energy… he just doesnt sound beera.. his look havent disappointed ..or the way mani captured.. for me movie was killed by dialogue delievery which was aweful.. he has the presence.. but boy o boy u need to sound beera…
ashwarya rai gives her career defining perfomance for me. i havent like her like i liked her today
BUT hero of this movie is MANI ratnam.. haunting, daring, visually stunning.. .tragedy.. forget ramayan this is entirely different film for me without thinking of epic.
RAAVAN is not an movie but an expierience if only ABHISEKH BACHAN had..
ACTUAL RATING- just watch it for mani ratnam please dont miss it..
its the best movie of the year for me inspite of the fact i didnt like the performance (something similiar to rajneeti where i didnt like ranbir)
Agree with Rooney. The movie is undoubtedly different. Its a visual treat, which should be enjoyed on the large screen. However, the lack of a good script lets it down. I am not that bright to get inferences from visual props as compared to old fashioned plot. So for me, it was a very strange experience, but it is definitely an Experience. Not a triviality.
Ash steals the show. Vikram does well in whatever little he has. But Abhi is a letdown. You may blame the script for this underwhelming performance, I feel that he was not consistent and ineffectual in being menacing when he had to, to the point of becoming comical. I wonder what/who inspired him with all that jhik-jhik-jhik stuff. To me, it was akin to a spaghetti performance, great in parts, absolutely mediocre in parts and just falling flat otherwise. The surprise package of this movie is Aishwarya Rai Bachchan. Relax guys, at least one Bachchan shone through this movie.
My 2 cents.
Also, that starting 2 minutes with the various cuts/shots was bizarre. I understand non-linearity, but this is ridiculous. When you have set out to make a movie for the masses, why tinker drastically with known formulas for success. Why do all this experimentation and totally rock the boat. Audiences in India have not yet matured to the level to accept all this.
There were many other such instances, and seriously, to a normal daal-bhaat viewer of bwood, it wud seem that something went wrong at the editing table. Woh sochega ki do-chaar rolls mix up ho gaye.
As an example, I will bring in Ghajini. It is supposed to be a ripoff of Memento, but I can bet that had it actually been a frame-to-frame ripoff, it wudve flopped bigtime in India. The makers took the core and applied it beautifully to a standard masala script. I think Mani Ratnam has failed here.
Nykavi, but Rathnam’s intentions were clearly different from the GHajini director’s..
I wouldn’t only blame the Indian audience.. many films just fail with many audiences around the world.. filmmakers have lost crores of rupees and millions of dollars too. But they’ve also given us films like Mera Naam Joker and Citizen Kane in the bargain. I cannot truthfully say that I would prefer profitable Himmatwalas (much as I enjoy these films) to Guru Dutt’s Pyaasa!
Of course why is the ‘loss’ element introduced only with such films when most commercial films also flop? The last time I checked Hindi cinema had a success rate of 6-8%! So shouldn’t the lesson be the opposite one? if you have to lose money do so doing something worthwhile that might even stand the test of time!
Well, art has no true price, is always a valid argument. And I agree with you about the intent of the one who wants to challenge, or who wants to do something pathbreaking. I dont think anyone is ignoring the loss of major commercial mainstreamers. We have plenty of litered debris of such ventures over the history of cinema. Avatar too was pathbreaking, but it just about managed to keep audience interest intact to rake it in. Ravan tries to straddle both commercial and arty. IMO, that was a gamble which somehow doesnt seem to have paid off.
Commercial mainstreamers spend the moolah to create all the whizbang which can guarantee that the audience is forced to come to a theatre to experience it all. From that aspect, Mani has passed with flying colors. Its the script which is thin.
I think my frustration out here is due to another wasted opportunity. Believe me, I felt the same after D6 as well as JBJ.
Exactly my point NyKavi. You do not experiment with 100 cr. If it was a 10 cr movie, heck it would be on it’s way to be a success. I am surprised someone as experienced as Mani Ratnam did not understand it.
Kites And Raavan Fetch 18 Crore Combined For Satellite Rights
Saturday 19th June 2010 19.30 IST
Boxofficeindia.Com Trade Network
Reliance Big Pictures had initially sold the satellite rights for Kites and Raavan along with second run rights of some 20 films to Colors for 45 crore but when Kites disappointed at the box office the TV Channel told Reliance Big Pictures it will not be able to pay 45 crore and the deal needs to be renegotiated.
The deal had to come down to 30 crore as Colors were prepared to lose the 2.50 crore advance it had paid to Reliance Big Pictures if the price did not come down.
The second run rights of the 20 films have been sold to NDTV for 12 crore leaving the Kites and Raavan rate at 18 crore for Colors.
This was the situation before the release of Raavan and with Raavan heading towards a worse box office fate than Kites, even the discounted price looks big. The fate of these two big films will make TV channels think twice before making a big money deal prior to release and without knowing a particular film’s fate at the box office. If the original deal had been kept that would have meant a combined price of 33 crore for Kites and Raavan which is more than the combined price of My Name Is Khan and Housefull and both these films are theatrical hits at the Indian box office.
hmmm…
its the world of twitters and facebook.. audience reaction and their feedback reaches people even before the film releases..
has happened with 3 idiots, kites and raavan with extreme reactions.. while 3 idiots soared to the skies, opposite happened with the latters..
even if the movie isnt bad in general, people have started to bad mouth anything that they didnt expect ..
maybe without these premiers and pre release previews and reviews flowing in all quarters, the films may not have met the same fate..
(i may be speaking a bit too soon on raavan but still….)
you can add raajneeti to that list. the mulltiplex business for raajneeti is unexpected, and one has to believe twitter/fb/sms/online reviews have contributed to it substantially.
Pranay,
Thats a risk one has to take.
In India as well as in Hollywood people have tried releasing movies without special previews or leaking out anything prior to release without success. It is taken as a sign of lack of confidence in the product. OTOH, Ipersonally believe that instantly available and shareable info does not really have that much impct. Liked films s till succeed and unliked ones bomb. Piracy on the other hand has had a far greater impact.
I believe that to some extent these things do influence.
It is a classic case of BHED CHAAL.
I remember 3I days. There seemed to be this one upmanship in how many times one has seen it. So if one said 5 there was another one saying 8 and so on. There seemed to be a kind of competition.
On the other hand when a film is bad mouthed a lot of people do stay away. Those who brave it usually come back saying ‘huh, it wasn’t as bad as everyone said.’
I think kites really would have done a bit more.
Raavan would have had a better opening.
There was everything going for it. The music was popular, the previews were quite impressive, so I feel the only thing that kept a substantial number away was the viscious way in which views were expressed on Thursday itself.
isn’t it all apparent, if a big movie has bad WOM, it flops instantly (Kites, Raavan, Veer)
if a big movie has good WOM, it becomes an unprecedented Blockbuster (3 idiots, Raajneeti)
if it is mixed, it ends up in the middle like MNIK, Housefull
This is because WOM is travelling quicker (twitter/fb/blogs/tv/sms) now as compared to the 90s.
Mani Ratnam’s modern-day Ramayana, toplining Abhishek Bachchan, Aishwarya Rai Bachchan, Vikram and Govinda, opened yesterday. And the buzz is that it won’t be easy for the Hindi-Tamil bi-lingual (with a dubbed Telugu version too) to recover its Rs 100 crore-plus investment (excluding prints and publicity).
Trade analyst Taran Adarsh admits that “the opening isn’t good” but says it’s too early to write it off. “A clearer picture will emerge after the initial curiosity wears off,” he says. Another trade analyst, Komal Nahta, attributes the slow start to the promos that didn’t convey much. “Today, the audience wants to know what the movie is about before they buy a ticket,” he says. “Besides, the film has turned the Ramayana around in the end and Indians don’t like mythology being tampered with.”
Industry veteran Amod Mehra shares the sentiment: “The Friday morning show had barely 20 per cent occupancy. One can’t imagine this from the director of Roja, Bombay, Yuva and Guru.”
Other arguments against the film are that the story is supposedly set in Madhya Pradesh, yet cops are seen wearing Uttar Pradesh police badges, someone is reading a local Jhansi newspaper, some things are typically Maharashtrian, the boats are from Kerala and a cap from China.
Stands a chance
Despite the negative reports, Devang Sampat, vice president, Cinemax, is hopeful of the film picking up during the weekend. “The afternoon show on Friday was about 50 per cent full. There’s Abhishek and Aishwarya Bachchan, South star Vikram, and it’s a Mani Ratnam film,” he says, but believes that the Tamil version will generate better collections because down south, people have a different perception of Raavan.
Nahta too feels that the Tamil Raavan, featuring Vikram as Beera, will do better because he’s a huge star there. Mani Ratnam too has a huge fan following. He signs off saying, “I don’t see the Hindi Raavan succeeding at the box-office.”
“Taran and Masand should be ashamed to give 1.5 stars for this type of movie.”
Wow. Why? Do they not have freedom of speech? They cannot express their views or opinions, especially since they are firmly in the majority. I never expected this much biased opinions from this site.
LOL..whoever gives bad reviews to Raavan are now bad people…?? what logic is this??
The bottomline is the audince have rejected it big time…Tiny number of pseudo intellectuals doesnt matter at the end…..Even they are liking the movie for the sake of liking…
Nahta too feels that the Tamil Raavan, featuring Vikram as Beera, will do better because he’s a huge star there.
- What’s this comment?
I’ve heard South version is better due to better dialogues, better connectivity between scenes and Vikram’s acting. We have to see whether Vikram’s characterization is different from Hindi one
Another thing I’ve noticed in Theatre was, most people are from South(AP). I’ve hardly found any north Indian. Tamil one is playing at the same time, not found any Tamilians either.
That is little below Expectations, but we can say the people(and there are substantial) who are Ash fans and prefer Tamil, so there could be Audience Division there.
besides Roja, all Mani Ratnam movies are style over substance. In Roja, he managed to invoke patriotic feelings. In Anjali, feelings for a family. Unfortunately, he’s gone downhill since.
Mani’s movies are like watching a 2.5 – 3 hr MTV music video. All style, but you don’t emotionally connect.
excuse me for saying this but that’s an appalling view.. it’s like saying a great poet doesn’t know how to write because he cannot connect and sell enough books!
But it would be perfectly accurate to say that the “great poet” does not know how to write to appeal to the general public.
That is the flaw I find with this argument. What makes a creative work or its creator “great”? Now for instance, I can recall instantly the words and music to certain advertisements from my childhood, both in India and North America. I don’t consider these jingles as “great art” in the same class as, say, a Subbulakshmi concert, but then I have to acknowledge that they had something noteworthy about them to be remembered And it’s not simply that my brain was much less cluttered in childhood, so I can better recall events from those days, because in that case, why don’t i remember *all* of the advertising jingles from that period? The answer is that they succeeded in what they set out to do, namely, to make themselves remembered in the consumer’s mind, while Subbulakshmi succeeded in what she set out to do. The person who finds Subbulakshmi’s singing to be caterwauling and prefers filmi music can be said not to have the training to appreciate classical music, but you cannot dismiss that person’s musical tastes for that reason. In fact, the greatness of people like Subbulakshmi lies precisely in the fact that even people without the requisite background and training can appreciate her music.
And conversely, being unappreciated by the masses is not in itself proof of being too great for their understanding. There are a lot of bad classical musicians around!
SM, you’ve answered your own question! How many great poets were expected to produce bestsellers! Your Subbulakshmi analogy is fairly inaccurate. That’s like comparing a Beethoven performance at Lincoln Ctr to the number of albums Guns ‘n Roses sell! It is already a rarefied audience that approaches this kind of work. And for those who do impressionistically they go in with the right ‘mental’ attitude. There are certain films that play in arthouse theaters and get a certain kind of reception even when they’re not liked. You’ve already limited the set! Ravi Shankar is a giant of Indian classic music BUT he is not expected to outsell Laxmikant-Pyarelal!
But even within ‘art’, even within that rarefied world some artists are a lot more accessible than others. More people can read Dickens than James Joyce. Does this mean there’s a problem with the latter?! Just because Dickens is more accessible than Joyce does not automatically make him greater and no critic would argue this. Most of 19th century Western verse was accessible to the informed (thought not expert) reader the way 20th century verse isn’t. No one thinks this itself is a problem with the latter! We can’t instantly appreciate Picasso the way we might a certain sort of landscape painter. What does this mean?
And I honestly don’t see what the objection here is. Are we saying that those trained in a field have opinions only as valid as those who are not! So my opinion on film music should count every bit as much as S Janaki’s?
Now perhaps a Rathnam movie shouldn’t be sold as a regular commercial release. That’s a different argument.
If you don’t like a certain modernist writer that’s fine. But if you then start suggesting he or she doesn’t know how to write some challenges would be in order!
Incidentally I know I come off as arrogant or insensitive or at least undiplomatic when I say some of these things. But the greatest arrogance is to be certain about something that one ought not be so certain about. So to use my earlier example I shouldn’t be certain about the distinctions between airbus and Boeing! I am not stopping anyone from having an opinion. This is not a credentials check by any means. But similarly there should be a certain humility on the other side as well.
By the way that earlier age you referred to where Subbulakshmi had TV jingles.. yes I too wish I was part of that age.. much as Hindi cinema once upon a time also bred better audiences.. or at least the dynamics of that age allowed a better space for ‘responsible’ cinema and one which could flourish at times much more than regular entertainment. But we are not in such an age in Hindi cinema and its viewers. Now Tamil cinema would be a different matter. If Raavanan were rejected in Tamil (looks like it might be a success there) I would never make the same charge because there a lot else in ‘new’ Tamil cinema has succeeded. And other stuff as well from Bala to Kamal.
Satyam: “Now perhaps a Rathnam movie shouldn’t be sold as a regular commercial release. That’s a different argument. ”
Yes, this is exactly the argument that i think Jeevcy and others are engaging in. A film that is sold for 100 crore has different responsibilities than one that is sold for 10 crore. By definition the former has to appeal to a wide section of the audience, and, if it fails to do so, can be rightly called a failure, whatever be its aesthetic merits, and those calling it so need not be denigrated for their artistic insensitivities. That is the only point I have been trying to make in various posts here. When you make a film on commercial terms, you shall be judged on those terms, and they are valid in that context.
The ad jingles I was referring to weren’t by Subbulakshmi! I know she acted in films (Hindi ones, too — Meera, I believe), but I don’t know if she ever sang ad jingles. When I referred to her being appreciated by even the untrained and untutored, I was referring to things like her UN concert.
SM, I’ve already addressed this point in past days. By that token Citizen Kane and Vertigo and Kaagaz Ke Phool and Mera Naam Joker and the Searchers and tons and tons of films that have since been considered canonical or touchstone films also did not fulfill their responsibilties!
Actually before they went to their graves there were those dug up for them by the journalists of their age when they made those films and had there been blogs at that time folks like yourself would have been saying pretty much the same thing. 50 years later it’s easy to claim the opposite when history has spoken. Guru Dutt wasn’t driven to suicide just like that! Raj Kapoor never recovered from the MNJ failure. In each case things would have been easier if the media had helped them out. But of course it didn’t because it couldn’t. It didn’t have the tools to do so. It wasn’t just about the box office. Similarly with Raavan no one has to like the film but what’s the hysteria for?
Of course as I ALWAYS say Abhishek is supposedly minor till a big film of his fails and then it’s a TITANIC failure! It’s only a major event when he flops!
You know Satyam, once the movie reaches that cult status (which I know it will never), you can bloat about it here on SS. I will come over and congratulate you over here. Celebrating it now is premature when most reviews/audience reaction are negative.
It is similar to SRK fans claiming MNIK will cross 100 cr overseas in the 47th release overseas.
Jeevcy, I’ve never depended on democratic majorities for my opinions and won’t here. You’re wasting your time. I think highly of the film. I’ve never insisted that others do also. That’s it!
For the many fans of Mani Ratnam’s sublime cinema, myself included, Raavan will be a disappointment. Mani sir takes the universal tale of the Ramayana, familiar to everyone in yearly Ram Leelas, and re tells it in a boring, trivial manner.
Sure, Raavan has unexplored natural locations and is stunningly shot, with misty ravines, raging waterfalls and deep gorges filling the screen, but the narrative is poor, the dialogues clunky, the screenplay repetitive, all of which makes the film a tedious experience. Abhishek Bachchan plays Beera , a renegade outlaw somewhere in deeply forested Laal Matti, and is a mix between a Naxalite, Veerapan and Robin Hood. Supported by his two brothers Mangal (Ravi Kishen) and Haria (Ajay Gehi), he leads some brigands through jungles, killing cops, raiding police camps while looking after poor tribal villagers. We are told Beera is a legend. It doesn’t show.
A new tough cop, Dev (Vikram) is sent to ‘deal’ with him, except Beera kidnaps his beautiful wife, Ragini (Aishwarya), in a stunning scene where he crashes his large boat into her tiny canoe, shattering it. Vikram starts chasing Beera with forest guard Govinda, who finds hidden trails and jumps across trees, monkey like.
Vikram and his cops chase the elusive gang, who stay nearby. Abhishek almost kills Aishwarya except that she jumps off a cliff, while the brigands raid the cops’ camp. Aishwarya tries to escape but is caught, an assistant cop (Nikhil Dwivedi) is captured and tortured and Aishwarya tries escaping again. Damn. All this while, the chemistry between Abhishek and Aishwarya remains strained and confused, like the film.
Finally, Govinda finds Aishwarya but gets captured himself. In a truce, Gehi goes to meet Vikram who kills him. Yup, the plot has pointers from the Ramayana, except they don’t add up. Eventually you learn that Abhishek is on a vengeance because Vikram raided his sister’s (Priyamani) wedding. The police caught her and raped her till she committed suicide. The eventual resolution, when Vikram faces up to Beera over a precarious bridge is a bit stretched. And Vikram asking Aishwarya to take a polygraph test to prove her purity is truly corny.
Finally, Raavan fails in its principal casting, as Abhishek cannot pull off the menace that his character requires. He tries to goggle his eyes, beat his head like a tabla and mutter gibberish ‘chak chak chak’ in an attempt to signify deranged evil but fails as his city demeanor gives him away. One can almost see him on his I-phone after finishing a shot, saying ‘yo dude, whats up’.
Worse, though his face stays muddy, his teeth stay sparkling white: highly unlikely for a brigand outlaw in the forest. Aishwarya stays dirty through the film, screaming her way as she tries to escape, while Vikram is impressive, but with little scope for histrionics. Both Priyamani and Ravi Kishen are good in their brief roles, but it’s Govinda who steals the film in his sharp cameo. AR Rahman’s music is average by his standards and in the end so is Raavan.
Abhishek cannot pull off the menace that his character requires
I have to now bear with other’s flops also” – Ramu after the release of Raavan
By Joginder Tuteja, June 21, 2010 – 09:58 IST
Ram Gopal Varma Trust Ram Gopal Varma to allow a joke on himself time and again. He was the last man standing and came up with a big laugh even as his Aag was a butt of jokes for months at stretch. The jokes ended after a while but he never stopped laughing. So much so that in every major conversation with them, the topic of Aag invariably comes up and Ramu too doesn’t mind giving a byte or two on the making and the subsequent destruction of Aag.
No wonder, due to the very fact that he was laughing on his own work (Aag, Shiva – the new one – and some more films) meant that detractors had to find a new way to hit back on the filmmaker who doesn’t mind taking a dig on films by other people as well. While his sweet and sour war of words with Karan Johar comes with an ability of creating front page headlines till date, Ramu truly believes that ever since Aag, he has found himself in a position where he has to bear with other flops as well. Reason being that every time a film flops, it finds a reference to Aag by getting titled as ‘XYZ director ki Aag’.
Says Ramu with mock laughter, “When Tashan came, they said its ‘Aditya Chopra ki Aag’. For Chandni Chowk to China, it was Nikhil Advani ki Aag’. For Kites it was ‘Rakesh Roshan ki Aag’. Now Raavan is being termed as ‘Mani Ratnam ki Aag’. I guess apart from bearing with my own flops, I have to now bear with flops coming from others as well.”
While he is busy with bringing his epic film Rakta Charitra (arriving in two parts) closer to completion mark, Ramu is keeping himself abreast with what’s happening in the world of Bollywood. Also, he is allowing himself a chuckle or two with some of the famed films failing left, right and centre. No wonder, he doesn’t quite mind when reference to Aag comes in every few months.
“I have realized that Aag has now become more popular than Sholay”, he dares to make a bold statement, though with a reason, “That’s because a hit like Sholay comes once in a lifetime whereas a flop like Aag comes every few months. That’s the reason why there are so many references to Aag made time and again.”
Not to be bogged down by scathing comments that are usually reserved for him, he makes a final strike by stating, “I am happy that if not anything else, I at least managed to set up a bench mark for flops. I can see that Aag will live on for many more years to come.”
ravaan was a ok movie abhi and ash was superb vikram did a good job govinda was not bad . it was a bit slow in the first half but by the second half it was faster. all in all the first day collection of raavaan in three languages were around 20-21crore .if it carry on by the first three days it will gross around 33-36crore. i hope it will gross around 51-52crores in the weekend mnik grossed 90.2crore in the first three days and raajneeti grossed around 30-32crore hope raavaan will be a hit. it has two weeks before i hate luv storys hit the screens raavaan has a great chance.
i hate luv storys will gross 31-35crores in the first three days and in the weekend it will gross around 55-60crores and overall it will gross around 80-90crores it will be a superhit
Raavan failed to make any headway over the weekend at the box office after a poor start on Friday. The collections remained similar for the three days. Friday business was around 5.75 crore, Saturday was 5.25 crore nett and Sunday was 6 crore nett.
The film was poor in most circuits but single screens dominated circuits were very dull. CP Berar CI and Rajasthan are likely to stay below 1 crore for the whole week which is very bad for a major release. Mumbai grossed around 6.25 crore nett , Delhi/UP was 3.75 crore nett and East Punjab was 1.75 crore nett for the weekend.
The film is likely to show a big drop over the weekdays and the first week business is likely to finish at around the 23-24 crore nett range. The Tamil (Raavanan) and Telugu (Villian) versions did better comparatively as they grossed around 12 crore combined (8cr Raavanan, 4cr Villian) over the weekend but even their good business was limited to the bigger centres.
really bummed over how the film has been received critically and at the boc office. I didn’t believe it would be this bad.
Its made even worse because I liked the film. Sure there are things I wish Mani had done differently but to see films like MNIK ore even Kites by some critics be received better critically, well that really bothers me.
Box Office: Raavan’s opening weekend low; Raajneeti stays put
HETAL ADESARA 21 June , 2010
MUMBAI: The opening weekend box office numbers of Mani Ratnam’s Ravaan (Hindi) are in. The movie, which had a lot of expectations riding on it, had fetched Rs 170 million (Rs 17 crore) in the first three days of release in India.
The movie’s regional counterparts – Raavanan (Tamil) and Villain (Telugu) have collectively done Rs 120 million (Rs 12 crore) in the first three days.
As was earlier reported by Businessofcinema.com, on its opening day, Raavan’s net collections were Rs 60 million (Rs 6 crore), whereas that of its Tamil and Telugu versions combined were Rs 46 million (Rs 4.60 crore).
Prakash Jha’s Raajneeti in its third weekend is still going strong and done net business of Rs 45 million (Rs 4.50 crore) this past weekend in India. The movie has so far done a net business of Rs 815 million (Rs 81.50 crore) in 17 days.
This makes it the fourth highest collections of a movie in India so far after 3 Idiots (Rs 2.02 billion), Ghajini (Rs 1.15 billion) and Rab Ne Bana Di Jodi (Rs 850 million). Tied at the fifth spot for net box office collections are Dhoom 2 and Om Shanti Om at Rs 800 million.
TOP 5 FILMS’ NET COLLECTIONS
1) 3 IDIOTS – Rs 2.02 billion (Rs 202 crore)
2) GHAJINI – Rs 1.15 billion (Rs 115 crore)
3) RAB NE BANA DI JODI – Rs 850 million (Rs 85 crore)
Raavan in US: Good reviews, poor box office performance
June 21, 2010 11:14 IST
Raavan, which got fairly decent reviews in The New York Times and Los Angeles Times, opened to a disappointing box office in North America.
Distributor Reliance [ Get Quote ] has said it grossed $550,000 in three days. The previous Mani Ratnam film Guru which also paired Abhishek Bachchan [ Images ] and Aiswarya Rai had opened three years ago with a $1 million weekend in America and Canada [ Images ] and went on to earn an impressive $2.4 million in both countries.
If Raavan follows the standard rate of attrition in North America (about 60 percent slum in the second week), it will have a hard time reaching $1 million.
Many viewers in New York and New Jersey cinemas thought that the film was too brutal and at times very dark. A few said they had come to the theatres imagining the film was a modern day take on Ram, Ravan and Sita but were surprised by the twists in the story and that the character played by Vikram had shades of good and bad. They had thought only the character of Ravan would be dark and demonic.
It looks like Raavan will gross about half of what two recent successes have grossed in North America. Raajneeti, a bonafide success and Kites each grossed about $1.6 million in North America, though the latter was deemed a flop because of its huge production cost (estimated to be $20 million).
How Raavan will hold in the next two weeks will be crucial to the film’s final fate.
Meanwhile, it is getting some respect from mainstream publications.The New York Times called the film ‘richly atmospheric.’
It added: ‘Raavan has Bollywood glamour aplenty, with the lovely if occasionally dramatically challenged Aishwarya Rai Bachchan [ Images ].’
But the film’s real star is Mani Ratnam, it asserted, ‘ a talented visual storyteller who directs action crisply and fills the screen with striking images. Artful but not arty, Mr. Ratnam delivers the goods.
A R Rahman’s [ Images ] score is ‘excellent,’ the review added, and singled out ‘an eye-popping climactic battle, between the bad-good Beera and the good-bad Dev, on a teetering suspension bridge. And that, folks, is entertainment.’
LA Times argued that it is Aishwarya who is a scene-stealer in the film. ‘Bollywood superstar Abishek Bachchan has the title role of the romantic adventure epic Raavan, the review asserted, ‘ but the movie belongs to his exquisite real-life wife Aishwarya Rai. A blue-eyed beauty who resembles Myrna Loy…’
It added: ‘Director Mani Ratnam and his colleagues give Bollywood fans full value. Ratnam’s pace is steadfastly brisk, and his film is replete with dizzying camerawork, myriad complications, violent mayhem, broad humour, usual musical interludes, a cliffhanging climactic confrontation and a finish that strikes a note of poignancy.’
If only more desi viewers paid attention to the two reviews…
“A tiny section of multiplex-going audience has liked the film, while the masses have given it a thumbs down. ”
LOL … Taran has mentioned about Satyam and friends in his BO report
yup….Welcome, TZP both did well…and akki/aamir r good friends so they won’t have any problem with this….if someone will have problem, it will be Farah khan because she knows that her pot-puri masala will have serious threat from a quality film like Dhobi Ghaat….all in all, it will be a blast time for media for sure….:-)
that’s true – it is releasing in Dec’10 – i heard in one of aamir’s interview – can’t locate it now….
BTW, There is a CONFIDENTIAL and CONFIRM news that UTV is going for a MEGA RELEASE for PEEPLI LIVE – and i’ve myself heard this from ……well, m not supposed to disclose this…..so pl. book ur tickets in advance
Where everybody knows that MNIK underperformed in India it was not a rejected movie…It did 73 cr which is not bad…How many movies in India have crossed that 70 cr mark…Its overseas performance is spectacular…
Incase of Raavan it is a clear washout in whatver circuits it is released..cant be compared with MNIK’s BO…Raavan has been rejected by audince and critics alike…
I’m actually encouraged by the successive failures of MNIK, Kites, and Raavan. No, not because I’m some kind of sadist, but because it seems to show that the “mulitplex audience” that is supposedly the crucial component to box office success today, is not so star struck any more, but makes its ticket buying decisions on the quality of the film. If this trend is true, it is a very welcome sign.
BTW, does anyone know anything about an upcoming film called “Tere Bin Laden”? From the one promo I saw, it seems to be a spoof. I’m asking because it seems to have slipped under the radar of the kind of folks who made such a fuss about the “Dear Friend Hitler” project.
Raavan takes home Rs 530 million
Indiantelevision.com Team
(Updated at 21 June 2010 10:00 pm)
(21 June 2010 12:00 pm)
MUMBAI: Raavan has taken home Rs 530 million, according to opening weekend box-office figures released by its co-producer Reliance Big Pictures.
The Tamil version fared better than the Telugu one, pocketing Rs 110 million to demonstrate that it is a more popular character in Tamil Nadu than in Andhra Pradesh. The Telugu version garnered Rs 40 million worldwide, says a Reliance Big Pictures executive.
The Hindi make, starring Abhishek Bachchan and wife Aishwarya Rai, mopped up Rs 380 million at the box-office.
Raavan was released simultaneously in three language versions and 2,200 screens worldwide.
Box-office trackers said the film had a mixed response and couldn’t start as strongly as Housefull, Badmaash Company, Kites and Raajneeti.
Avers Fun Cinemas COO Vishal Kapur, “On the day of release, the film did average business. But Saturday onwards, the film started getting a lukewarm reception with the occupancy dwindling and varying between 25 and 30 per cent.”
On the opening day, the film got an occupancy between 50 to 60 per cent in several multiplexes. Industry trackers said the film, however, did poorly in other multiplexes and got occupancy between 20 to 30 per cent.
According to trade analyst Taran Adarsh, Raavan did not fetch the desired opening. “In Mumbai, the occupancy was extremely erratic. While in certain big city plexes, the film opened to a better response, it was much lower in the smaller centre plexes and single-screen theatres,” he says.
Meanwhile, Prakash Jha’s Raajneeti continues to rule and its two-week collections stand at Rs 780 million.
BREAKING NEWS: BOI confirms Raavan BIG HIT on Monday. Unbelievable! I never thought BOI will have Raavan and Hit in the same article leave aside the same sentence. All prayers of fans on SS have been answered …
SS folks, use the deeper analytical and interpretive skills that you have developed here and used so well for Raavan, and you will be able to conclude BOI is implying Raavan is a BIG HIT !! Do you now see what I see?
Some of this is getting tiresome.
A COUPLE OF POSTERS WITH NOTHING CONSTRUCTIVE TO OFFER ARE BOGGING THE SITE DOWN.
Much as you hate moderating//deleting, Satyam this is not serving any purpose.
I admit, I am reconsidering very strongly in a couple of instances.. I do dislike intervening in this sort of way (and I should add others have the ability to do this too here.. there are other refs.. who will go unnamed) but it would be a mistake for anyone to think that I will let those ethics become ‘suicidal’ for the blog..
Raavan weekend numbers in the US are lower than earlier suggested. It was supposed to be 551k but it’s actually 480k. This often happens when the Sun comes in lower than estimated.
CBO – June 18 to 25
Tuesday, 22 June , 2010, 10:41
Mani Ratnam’s Raavan in Hindi is a disaster, but he can take heart that Raavanan in Tamil has taken the best ever opening of the year at the CBO.
Mani’s loyal Chennai audiences has given a big thumbs up to Raavanan, which has netted a record Rs 90 lakhs in its opening weekend from 15 screens in the city and is in the number one position.
Singam has fallen to the number two position. At number three is The Karate Kid, a film which is holding on well against all opposition.
In fourth position is Hindi Raavan, which opened in six screens to 94 per cent opening on day one, but fell to 65 per cent subsequently.
In the last position is Irumbu Kottai Murattu Singam, which has made a comeback to the charts as publicity has been boosted by the producers.
a great opening was always expected and other than Rajni no one can match Vikram (or surpass) on his openings. Never mind who else the media proclaims as the top Tamil star! Even Surya usually is behind (going by Sify numbers in each instance.. and they’re hardly the greatest Vikram fans!), Vijay or Ajith are not even in the ballpark most days.
Having said that this Raavanan opening is behind Kandasamy’s 1.07 crores.
Thanks, Doga. But are all of these “big” in the sense that MNIK, Kites, and Raavan were? That is, are they considered to be “event” films, or films which will pull the industry out of its economic doldrums? I mean:
- IHLS — Imran, Sonam — not really big stars
- Khatta Meetha — has Akshay Kumar, true, but it seems to be a serious film, so is anyone expecting it to be “big” in a commercial sense? (it might be “important” in raising critical socio-political issues)
- Peepli Live — this is a tricky one. Could be an “important” film because of its subject matter, and might become “big” because Aamir is the producer, though he is not in the film, but is anyone really expecting it to be a blockbuster?
- Aisha – same as IHLSl. Might be a hit, even a big hit, but is anyone looking to it as a savior?
- Dabangg — well, it could be “big” in single screens for sure. But is Salman still considered “big” in an overall box office sense?
- No Problem — could be a big hit, I suppose
- Rakta Charitra — might be a hit, but will it be “big”? I also have my doubts whether it will be a hit, given its strong ties to AP politics.
I don’t know about the other two films you mentioned.
Been away and busy lately. will be back later. but just a quick post–enjoyed raavan-esp the first half.
infact the first half hour or so was what mani is known for—
the last half hour ws a bit of a let-down (for me)-something personal.
dont feel mani did much wrong (except the last half hour)–the way he is being criticised is a bit excessive..
ash and vikram were v good as expected.
abhishek tried hi bit but did not seem to be in his elements-did not take the bull by the horns…
if i need to sum it up in on sentence–abhishek missed an epic, life-changing opportunity…
Not read much reviews or even comments on this blog–just speaking on personal impression. he actually did not even giving his bet–there was a hint of casualness and even carelessness—totally out of place for an opportunity of this sort. maybe some people may find me a bit harsh, but he was the one who had the MOST on stake here, and he did not perform out of his skin.
and mani–one shot sums it up–the last scene where abhishek gets killed by a barrage of bullets –ash stood a foot away from him but was surprisingly shielded. this would be normal practice in a apoorva lakhiya “action epic” but not in a mani film.
feel sorry for amitabh who is having to defend abhishek and then defend his comments on manis editing.
agree with satyam that the editing would not have a decisive impact on box-office.
now am glad (for abhi) that he already has signed many movies pre-ravan release.
(although i hope it does not happen that way)–i feel it wont be the same for abhishek from now on–he will have to work v hard to avoid the downward spiral he is in for now….
feel he should forget about “cutting edge, prestige, dfferent” at the moment.
the ONLY criteria for choosing films (PROVIDED he gets decent scripts/offers) now needs for sometime now is BOx-OFFICE “safe” projects.
(although amitabh may be rite to some extent about manis editing fiasco in the film) he should not belittle himself by indulging in this sort of jack-in the-box comments on mani–the guy who ressurected his sons career.
Alex, why did you find the last half hour a let down? I found that in reading many reviews that most people including myself found the moments on the bridge and the scenes afterwards to be one of the highlights of the film.
on retropect, also may add–the subpar opening on the FIRst had something to do with the promos (primaily song promos only)–failed to enthuse the audiece the same way that the relatively innovative paa trailers
at my end(overseas), 90% of the promos showed thok de kili ONLY.
Saw a nahata tv show on film business, where he claimed that mani had made lot of “money” by selling the movie at a v high price much b4 release. the ones losing money will be reliance big pictures. as per nahata, loss will be at least 30 crores–not sure how he calculated?
Raavan doesn’t get an epic opening
22 Jun, 2010 04:00 pm
Reliance BIG Pictures and Madras Talkies extensively released their film Raavan in around 2200 screens worldwide making it the first Indian film to release simultaneously in Hindi Tamil and Telugu versions. The opening was average on Friday and with negative reports the business clearly dropped on Saturday.
As per the figures disclosed by the distributors, the opening day worldwide gross comes to Rs 20 crores and the first weekend worldwide gross collection is Rs 53 crores. But one has to take into consideration that this is the revenue generated from all the three versions of the film put together – Hindi ( Raavan ), Tamil ( Raavanan ) and Telugu ( Villain ).
The film worked primarily in multiplexes in metros but the business was poor in single screens and interiors. The negative word of mouth affected the film adversely in a massive way. Mani Ratnam faced a similar backlash when his film Yuva was released in 2004. The film opened to negative reviews and fared badly at the box office though it subsequently acquired cult status.
Sadly, prospects don’t seem to be any good for Raavan as the business that the film did is much lower to that of other recently released biggies. So though the film has no big opposition in its second week with considerably smaller releases in the form of Krantiveer – The Revolution (sequel to Nana Patelar’s 1994 hit Krantiveer ) and Mr Singh and Mrs Mehta (Aruna Shields – Prashant Narayanan), Raavan doesn’t seems to have any scope at the box office.
Raaajneeti continues to do well at the box office all over. The heavy fall for Raavan means that Raajneeti is doing rock steady business in the weekdays.
Raajneeti collected 97 lakhs nett on its third Friday and collections on its third Monday were 82 lakhs nett . A fall of just 15%. The business on Tuesday was 70 lakhs nett.
The business of Raajneeti after 19 days is 83.50 crore nett approx and the by the end of its third week it will be around the 85 crore nett mark. The film will have steady business in its fourth week as there is not much competition.
Raajneeti is looking to finish its nett business in the 90-92 crore region making it the third biggest nett grosser after Three Idiots and Ghajini.
June 18, 2010 at 1:25 AM
At a screening of Ravanan…interval- Vikram is simply phenomenal thus far.
June 18, 2010 at 1:37 AM
great to hear Abzee and not surprised at all! So you’re watching the Tamil before the Hindi?
June 18, 2010 at 3:31 AM
Just got done watching the film. I’ll be seeing the Hindi one as well, of course, but I saw the Tamil one first only because while Sandy’s reviewing the Hindi one for her paper…I’m gonna do the Tamil release. In any case, I was most certainly going to catch both versions.
Vikram just blew me away…on par, or even better than his Pithamagan perf. Aishwarya is also very good, and shares a crackling chemistry, full of sexual tension, with Vikram. The first half is kinda abrupt and short…would’ve liked more. The second half, surprisingly, does the delineation. And despite a rather clumsy finish, Ravanan’s strength is its bold subversion of the Hindu text (Raajneeti, take note!) which owes itself to Kamban as well as Mani’s own reading. I’m wondering if certain scenes and passages which directly invoke the Ramayana and pontificate on it will resonate in the Hindi version. The Tamil medium, given its umbilical bond with society & religion, seems naturally priviliged for such a subject. At the same time, the Hindi one has an obvious advantage vis-a-vis the Naxal politics, which given Ravanan’s Tirunelveli and Ambasamudram setting don’t gel or create the desired impact.
June 18, 2010 at 6:51 AM
thanks a lot.. hurrray nice to hear something positive
June 18, 2010 at 7:15 AM
Do you understand Tamil, Abzee?
June 18, 2010 at 7:48 AM
I’m born to a Maharashtrian father and a Tamilian mother. While I sadly can’t converse in Tamil, I can follow a movie fairly well…but I’ll still need subtitles to get the nuances. This one had thankfully released with subtitles.
Meanwhile my dad’s a Marathi journalist, but I don’t write very well in Marathi!
June 18, 2010 at 7:57 AM
Thank you.
That’s very interesting that they released the Tamil version with English subtitles. So did you see this in Mumbai? If so, I wonder how many other non-Tamils will be drawn to this instead of the Hindi version. People complained a lot about having to read subtitles in Kites.
June 18, 2010 at 7:39 AM
Look forward to your longer review on this, Abzee…I’m watching the Tamil version midweek this week, but in a few hours it’s the Hindi version.
The Indian reviews have been average to bad which isn’t the worst thing in the world given all those raves Kites and Rajneeti had recently. There’s clearly a schism between my experience of these movies and those of the reviewers…
I await the Rangan verdict. Hopefully on both versions.
June 18, 2010 at 7:53 AM
The Hindi one is getting bad reviews…I’ve not bothered reading all. But I wonder if it has to do with the lead performance, and the different approaches and registers adopted by the actors. This is a very author-backed film, and the titular portrayal can make or break it.
Also I was wondering, isn’t there a certain miscasting in having Abhishek play the Ravana coveting the Sita Aishwarya, given that they are married in real life. One can sense the sexual tension between Vikram and Aishwarya, especially when he says “I envy your husband and the man who got to you first”. Will that resonate when an Abhishek says it to Aishwarya, even though we all accept that its all acting…but surely these things work on a subconscious level during a performance.
Just food for thought!
June 18, 2010 at 7:59 AM
I can imagine you’re probably right about the casting…certainly it would have made things interesting if Abhishek did the Prithvi part in the Tamil version as Ratnam originally wanted…
I haven’t read the reviews myself but in skimming them one gets the sense that this is a terrible film which to put it bluntly I simply don’t buy.
June 18, 2010 at 8:08 AM
It isn’t a terrible film (like Kites) by any standards.
Raavan is multiple times better and a better idea of entertainment. Even if a failure in creative pursuits (To me, none of it worked ), Raavan should still be watchable (actually it’s better than rajneeti in some respects ).
June 18, 2010 at 8:01 AM
Actually abzee, abhishek being married to aishwarya isn’t the problem here. This is a genuine failure of a performance. The lack of sophistication and too many gimmicks affects the style of acting, in name of giving various ‘shades’ as per the nature of the titular role.
P.S: I’ve heard nothing but good to great reviews for Vikram in Tamil version. Want to watch it atleast for him..
June 18, 2010 at 7:56 AM
Reviewers who bashed kites and rajneeti have also bashed Raavan.
Saw Raavan, don’t want to come across like a typical reviewer calling it ‘visually great, bad performances, etc’, but it went totally ‘off’ for me. Nothing worked.
June 18, 2010 at 8:04 AM
I’m not saying that that the opposite isn’t true, but it doesn’t detract from the fact that my experience of late has not been those of the critics, particularly in this initial, ecstatic stage of elation for every other awful or half-decent film that comes out..
June 18, 2010 at 8:12 AM
I get what you’re saying.
I’m glad you’ll be able to watch it today. Looking forward to your views. Not that I agree or disagree with it, but it’ll be interesting to see how one could articulate why they liked a film like this.
June 18, 2010 at 8:16 AM
That’s IF I like it.
Will likely put up my thoughts either late tonight or tomorrow at some point.
June 18, 2010 at 8:16 AM
great to hear your take Abzee.. thanks!
June 18, 2010 at 4:00 AM
http://bollybusiness.wordpress.com/2010/06/18/raavan-off-to-very-good-start-at-ticket-window-mixed-reports/
June 18, 2010 at 8:17 AM
thanks Yakuza.. once again disproving the myth that Abhishek’s films don’t open well..
June 18, 2010 at 8:28 AM
BOI back to their old tricks:
http://boxofficeindia.com/npages.php?page=shownews&articleid=1757&nCat=news
and here’s Nahata:
http://koimoi.c2w.com/2010/06/18/box-office-report-dull-raavan-opening-shocks-trade/
June 18, 2010 at 10:41 AM
I don’t think BOI is reporting anything wrong here. From the reaction of even some Bachchan fans, this one seems to have missed the mark. This was always going to be a risky movie so I am not that surprised as far as box office is concerned. However, it seems that even the quality of the movie is coming under fire.
June 18, 2010 at 11:03 AM
I agree Cooldude. If anything, it is Yakuza who is way off mark.
June 18, 2010 at 11:16 AM
I expected Yakuza and IBOS to make this one work for as long as possible. IBOS is a joke but Yakuza seems fair from time to time
June 18, 2010 at 11:19 AM
CD, ibos too have mentioned this is set to lose
http://www.ibosnetwork.com/newsmanager/templates/template1.aspx?a=22150&z=4
response from bachchan fans: ibos is shit
June 18, 2010 at 11:31 AM
no I’m not surprised because their problems with the film are ideological. I said the same thing when JA released and people thought I was defending them. Doesn’t mean they’ll make up numbers or anything and I find this sort of piece depressing to be quite honest but the objection is ideological and the article makes this plain.
June 18, 2010 at 11:22 AM
some very strong language from IBOS…a surprise indeed. Let’s say what they say tomorrow.
June 18, 2010 at 11:04 AM
BOLI will report whatever the “”movie is doing”"..How can BOI say it is doing well when in reality its not doing well ???
June 18, 2010 at 9:40 AM
http://ibnlive.in.com/news/raavan-beheaded-by-the-audience/124757-8-66.html
June 18, 2010 at 9:55 AM
just happened to see this movie in big cinemas in navi mumbai. Average I would say…. better than Kites. But I am worried about the box office of this film. the big cinemas hall here for 4pm show was about half filled.
same time on the first day rajneeti was 90%. Bachchan aish and vikram have all done good job.
June 18, 2010 at 10:00 AM
Shernik, thanks for the postive update.
June 18, 2010 at 10:00 AM
crowd reaction:
http://www.bollywoodhungama.com/broadband/video/First-Day-First-Show/LK7Xw354/3/First-Day-First-Show-Of-Raavan.html
negative even here..
June 18, 2010 at 10:04 AM
so Abhishek is still looking for his first 50+ grosser while new comers like Ranbir and Imran have a few in APKGK, JTYJN, Raajneeti. Does not seem Raavan will get him there as well.
June 18, 2010 at 10:06 AM
http://beta.thehindu.com/arts/cinema/article472313.ece?homepage=true
Unfortunately, he has gambled on the wrong actor to carry out a larger-than-life role. Abhishek Bachchan is best when he is understated and reserves his bouts of anger to a few scenes. This approach worked in Yuva and Guru, but here with little socio-political context, Abhishek as Beera fails to find his feet.
June 18, 2010 at 10:25 AM
I like this:
You will either hate it or love it very much, but you can’t ignore it ##raavan
June 18, 2010 at 10:26 AM
Mayank Shekar – 1.5 stars Raavan
http://www.hindustantimes.com/Mayank-Shekhar-s-Review-Raavan/Article1-559700.aspx
June 18, 2010 at 10:34 AM
Extremely saddened by how this has turned out.
Mani somehow seems to have lost the plot here and it happens to a lot of directors with their ‘pet’ projects. They lose objectivity and come out with deeply flawed and whimsical prodcuts. Raavan seems such a case.At the end of the day, if people dont like it – it just wasnt good enough. Cant blame the public.Abhi shares the blame too as this is not the first time this has happened. His judgement about commercial viability of his films seems faulty. It doesnt make him any less talented but puts multiple question marks against his commercial viability.
Abhi has a few more chances but with each costly dud, he is using them up pretty fast.
It is nauseating how some fanatics are behaving tho. But, I guess they have a cause to rejoice.
It still is pretty sad if the only pleasure one has in life is to celebrate the failure of others.
June 18, 2010 at 10:43 AM
You’re totally right about Abhishek but no one in their right mind would turn down Ratnam. One has to be Aamir (and i’m not just talking about effective script sense, but also industry “currency”) in order to pass on India’s most respected commercial filmmaker.
June 18, 2010 at 10:45 AM
Aamir frequently talks about how he had to pass on Mahesh Bhatt when Bhatt was at his peak and Aamir an one film wonder.
June 18, 2010 at 10:48 AM
The problem with any actor in bollywood not named Aamir Khan is that when a Mani Ratnam approaches you for a role, you don’t have the balls or the credentials to challenge him on the script. You just sign on the line and read the script on the first day of shooting!!! This is what industry thinks of a Ratnam or Bhardwaj. Once in a while, these guys are bound to fail (not talking BO). Even if Raavan is a complete disaster, every actor in bollywood except one will be outside Ratnam’s house waiting for him to sign him.
June 18, 2010 at 10:49 AM
Yes,GF but I think the star-actor has to be able to sense if the director is going awry and steer them back on course. Might be difficult with such a prestigious director but this is not their first project together. 100 crores is a lot of money riding on a project. While BO is not the end all and be all, this kind of costly disasters hurt the industry as a whole. There has to be some fiscal responsibility in terms of budget and commercial viability of a product.
June 18, 2010 at 10:59 AM
I just think we’re all getting a bit ahead of ourselves.
June 18, 2010 at 12:00 PM
Yup, to some extent but writing is clear on the wall.
Still, happens. Atleast hope it is a good film for the fans of Abhi/Ash/Rathnam regardless of BO performance.
June 18, 2010 at 10:46 AM
rajen,
I don’t think when acting in Mani’s films actors think of commercial viability. But when they finalize the characterization of Raavan, that definitely comes into picture. Abhi is good with comedy, you can make villian mix with comedy that does wonders to box office. Who wants tos ee maniac in teh whole movie?
I didn’t like images of Gowrikar’s film. We have to wait !! I am sure he exces in Mani’s films, if he get chance again.
June 18, 2010 at 10:47 AM
“Abhi has a few more chances but with each costly dud, he is using them up pretty fast.” – i agree rajen and i’ve always thought this abt. abhi…but, i do see him as a very successful producer down the line…..he may do well to concentrate more on that side of film world….
June 18, 2010 at 10:48 AM
idea, don’t push hime to production yet. I feel D-6 and Raavan are the biggest setbacks. But he will survive and we want to see his movies.
June 18, 2010 at 10:55 AM
ted, abhi will be there as an actor for many many years to come – i’ve said that earlier also – but i believe that he will be far more successful as a producer…..
June 18, 2010 at 10:59 AM
“”"It still is pretty sad if the only pleasure one has in life is to celebrate the failure of others.”"
Agree here…I am sad the way abhi is being dismissed..Equallly sad for HR when he was dismissed…But dont most of us here have a little saddistic streak…?? I mean so called intellectuals in this blog have made a life out of being saddistic and dismissing movies of various stars(YOu know whom i am hinting)…
Wasnt it a mistake yo hype up Raavan at the first place ???
June 18, 2010 at 11:02 AM
‘saddistic and dismiing movies of various stars (You know who I am hinting)’
Aftabh Shivdisani deserved it….He is a terrible actor and a waste. Don’t try and defend him!!!
June 18, 2010 at 11:32 AM
what are you smoking ??? Ganja or charas??
June 18, 2010 at 11:42 AM
Charas…try it and you might understand what I am trying to say.
June 18, 2010 at 11:46 AM
No because I will keep dismissing some of those films today, tomorrow and forever.. it’s not about the stars but the films. I’ll defend Dil Se every day of the week and be ruthlessly dismissive of RNBDJ every day of the week too.. Is it wiser for a commercial star to do the latter than the former? Sure! But that isn’t exactly an argument for quality cinema. If one isn’t in it for this that’s one prerogative but one might not be into a great novel or a fine sitar player either. Pritam isn’t exactly better than Ravi Shankar because he sells more!
June 18, 2010 at 10:39 AM
STARDUST VERDICT
Aishwarya Rai Bachchan rocks in her performance but Abhishek Bachchan is not as good as in ‘Guru’. The weakest link of the flick is its storyline. This Mani Ratnam’s flick may be a work of art visually, but the hoi polloi will find it hard to digest despite of it being somewhat modeled on the popular epic ‘Ramayana’. However, the excellent publicity and big star cast should ensure a good opening at the box office. The film is definitely a downer by the high standards of Mani Ratnam’s earlier master pieces.
http://www.magnamags.com/index.php/201006186423/stardust/scoop-of-the-day/abhishek-raavan-great-visuals-no-yuva-or-guru-movie-review.html
June 18, 2010 at 10:41 AM
Mani’s best years are way behind him.
June 18, 2010 at 10:48 AM
i would contradict and simply suggest he never had great years in hINDI cinema (@ box office) or even yuva tamil i heard was better product..
i heard that raavanan tamil is rocking due to vikram then i feel only reason raavan hindi isnt there abhi needs to take blame.. and also i ask a question who else from bollywood would have played raavan .. tamil has options and if tamil is hit.. it just proves mani is yet to cross barriers ..
June 18, 2010 at 10:54 AM
Tamil Raavanan is also getting flak, only difference is Vikram’s performance is being appreciated.
June 18, 2010 at 10:55 AM
Rooney, two issues here:
1)All the reviews that are very positive on Raavan (Indian and Western) are all positive on Abhishek as well. For example Aseem Chabria called it his best work. So there is plenty on the other side.
2)As for the Tamil media they wouldn’t have been this harsh on Abhishek by a long stretch if it had been a Tamil film. The Bombay media has its particular problems.
3)Looking at all the reviews I’d be surprised if the film completely failed in Hindi and were a complete hit in Tamil. I doubt there will be that sort of gap. I’d be very surprised to learn otherwise.
June 18, 2010 at 11:27 AM
interesting.. i hope so.. looking forward to ur views.. and gf update..
June 18, 2010 at 11:32 AM
I am not saying the film will work in Hindi.. I’m saying that it might not work in Tamil either.
June 18, 2010 at 10:52 AM
In Tamil, you can find few actors can do raavan type of roles. Every actor has already done one or two similar roles. In Bollywood, you hardly find as the response from audience is also not great for this type.
June 18, 2010 at 10:52 AM
I am quite convinced this will be a very good film.. it is actually just the opposite of what the media is making it out to be.. this IS the signature Rathnam film, at least since the 90s. Guru was the deviation. he is talented enough to produce a hit when he really needs to but his heart is much more in edgier subjects. Not that he thinks these will be flops but he clearly takes risks. The rathnam of the 80s delivered nothing box office hits once he got his first success. in the 90s he became much more of the ‘pop-auteur’ and the results have been very mixed. Thalapathy his big film with Rajni didn’t work (to give Hindi viewers a sense of what this means it’s like a very big director not working with Bachchan at his peak.. a bit like Silsila), then he had Iruvar, his most ambitious film, this too didn’t work. In between a Hollywood style adventure film also failed in Thiruda Thiruda. Roja was a success as was Bombay. Alaipayuthey (saathiya original) was a very successful film, he then followed it up with a box office disappointment in Kannathil Muthamittal. Dil Se was a washout in Hindi. Yuva/Ayudha Ezhuthu didn’t work in either language though they were hardly the worst flops either way. Guru worked in a big way. And now it obviously looks extremely ominous for Raavan.
Now I’d take all of his films that didn’t work over most of those that did. Many of these films have had a rich afterlife too. But that’s for the history books!
June 18, 2010 at 11:00 AM
his movies save for a few do not invoke emotional attachments. I was watching Dil Se in the theatre with much expectations after Roja, and I was like “WTF!! what is your point Mr. Ratnam?”
Movies like Roja, Anjali managed to strike either a patriotic chord or a family chord. But his most recent works have failed in that. He has lost the ability to have the audience connect with the characters.
June 18, 2010 at 11:21 AM
Kannathil Muthamittal is probably his most emotionally affecting film and it wasn’t exactly an “older” film.
June 18, 2010 at 11:01 AM
You are probably right Satyam but spending 100 crores of someone elses money in pursuit of such ‘good films’ is not responsible. He has in a way screwed Abhi over too with what increasingly looks like a commercial dud.It is never pretty sight when a big film crashes and when it stars one of your favs, it is very disheartening. Anyway, regardless of who is to blame, Abhi has to get more careful going forward. It is all well and good working with prestigious directors but once in a while you need to give a hit too.
June 18, 2010 at 11:03 AM
Don’t worry, you’ll get your Dostana 2.
June 18, 2010 at 11:03 AM
There were rumours that mani has paid very less money to artists and completed the film in 40 cr. and sold it for 100cr.
June 18, 2010 at 11:35 AM
Rathnam is one of the smarter money managers around.. and the price of the film given two versions is indeed economical.. distribution price is anothr matter.
June 18, 2010 at 6:48 PM
I think the idea here is to make sure your film gets a good reasonable price in the context of the risk it has. And many films are over priced tremendously because someone early in the chain wants to make a big profit and some is willing to take that risk [foolishly or recklessly].
Without seeing Raavan I would just say in Hindi format Ratnams record is patchy but after success of Guru there would be significant interest in a Ratnam/Abhishek/Aish project. But is the price worth 100Cr? I don’t know what kind of business the film has to do to be considered a profitable project but surely at a big price business in India needs to be net of 100Cr with all versions. Maybe more. It’s a big ask especially when South market is cornered by one version and North by another. 2 movies this maybe but one cannot assume the Hindi version will make its “market potential” if it were a sole release compared to Tamil vs. Hindi. i.e. how many people will watch both versions? Probably small population. So this is quite easily one film really and should be treated as such due to hardly any overlapping business.
So at least 100Cr net I would guess or more from India to break even or maybe even 125Cr.
Now I am not into the price of a movie to judge its verdict. I am just purely talking economics here and not verdicts. How probable is a film to make 100Cr+++++ net across India? Unless your Aamir, no one has done it.
Some of the deals struck are very illogical and obviously some distributors have more money then they want!
June 18, 2010 at 10:55 AM
They advertise so much, but not taken care of simplest things:
1) What kind of poster is that? Everywhere same? How does it craete interest?
2)same Thode song in every channel. Not much of other songs.
3) over usage of faces ->
June 18, 2010 at 11:01 AM
Ted, when a film fails (or in this case seems to be failing) we sometimes forget the basics. See my note above. It is Raavan that is Rathnam’s pattern, not Guru! Note how I never predicted anything for Raavan the way I did for Guru. Also note that I saw it as being either a very big success or a big failure and not in between. I was obviously hoping for the best but I always had that Rathnam history in mind. If Abhishek were to do another film with Rathnam tomorrow and if it were a less ambitious work I’d predict big things once again. If it were a more ‘interesting’ work I’d again say the very same thing. People who know their Rathnam forget the history. Of course most of the reviewers and others have probably not see more than just Hindi Rathnam.
Also we must get away from the media hysteria. Guru dutt did not make bad films because the media in his generation thought he did. Commercial filmmaking is always tricky when a director goes out of the audience’s comfort zones and Rathnam does that regularly. But he wouldn’t have his prestige if he didn’t. And the Western reviewers (who have reviewed this seriously unlike Kites and many other ‘Bollywood’ films which are reviewed with a condescension) have appreciated it quite a film. Many reviews are superlative.
It is deeply disappointing to see what’s happened. I don’t disagree with Rajen. But let’s not make the film’s quality a function of its box office. And I’m not afraid to say a film is a disaster when I feel it’s one (Drona for example). But all the review attention actually convinces me that Rathnam has made a fine film here.
June 18, 2010 at 11:06 AM
Satyam, I am disappointed with Abhishek’s characterization than box office failure. (haven’t seen the movie yet, sensed from the trailors itself). Suhasin once commented that Mani’s films miss box office.
June 18, 2010 at 11:12 AM
I guess this going the JBJ way!!
June 18, 2010 at 11:20 AM
Indian epic romance “Raavan” is breathtaking
Filled with rich colours and lively action, Mani Ratnam’s classically themed epic “Raavan” brings together the mythology of Indian culture and the flair and fun of Bollywood with tremendous flourish.
Cinematographers Manikandan and Santosh Sivan with production designer Samir Chanda and editor A. Sreekar Prasad serve Ratnam superbly with images, settings and vitality that take one’s breath away.
Success is inevitable throughout India and with expat audiences. Such is the flare of the filmmaking that international audiences also can be expected to respond positively. The 130-minute film opens Friday in Britain.
The story is drawn from the legend of Ramayana, Raavan, a 10-headed demon-god who kidnaps Sita, the wife of Lord Rama. He must hack off all those heads in order to recover his beloved. Top Bollywood actress Aishwarya Rai plays Ragini, the ravishing wife of a police inspector she calls Dev. He is played by the actor Vikram, who has moved to take over policing a remote part of Northern India filled with jungles, ravines, imposing cliffs and waterfalls. Abhishek Bachchan (Rai’s real-life husband) plays Beera Munda, a multifaceted character whom some regard as a criminal but others revere as a benefactor.
When Beera’s family is brutally victimized by the police during a wedding, he retaliates by kidnapping Ragini and taking her deep into the mountainous outback. Dev sets out with his men to bring her back.
Shot in two versions in the Hindi and Tamil languages — the Hindi version will play in most international territories — the film mixes styles with great invention so that the drama is filled with intensity. There also are dynamic musical sequences enhanced by the irresistible music of A. R. Rahman, Oscar-winning composer of the “Slumdog Millionaire” score. These musical sequences include a splashing war dance at a jungle temple, a romantic portrait of domestic bliss and a celebration of impending nuptials; the choreography is as bold and striking as the music.
Vikram cuts a strong figure as the police officer, though in his dark glasses, he often resembles a sinister hard man from a film about a South American dictator. Bachchan has fun with a character who is fierce, passionate and dangerous but also comic in his self-doubt over whether to kill his captive or make love to her. As for Rai, the camera adores her just as it loves the mist on the river, the rainfall in the jungle and the white water surging over rocky cliffs. She, too, is a force of nature. The film makes the most of it.
http://uk.news.yahoo.com/22/20100618/ten-uk-film-raavan-5fdf947.html
June 18, 2010 at 11:22 AM
“Success is inevitable throughout India and with expat audiences. Such is the flare of the filmmaking that international audiences also can be expected to respond positively. ”
this makes me smile..
June 18, 2010 at 11:29 AM
this is very disappointing as to what has happened here!! i had high hopes from this one..nd i dont know..maybe i will like the movie once i watch it..(yes..i haven’twatched it still!!)..
but the bad thing is that its neither being appreciated critically nd not doing that well commercially as well..except the camerawork..nothing is being praised..yes..absolutely NOTHING!!
as an abhi fan..must say ..its a very very SAD day today!! nd his next is ashutosh’s film for which i dont have any high hopes..looks like a very very dull year for him now..!! i think he seriously has to do some commercial films now…its all very good nd gr8 working with “prestigious” directors (as rajen said)..but i have often seen..that d kinds of films he makes..the scripts he chooses..fails to excite nd enthuse the audience…!! time is running out for him..with every flop movie..u only lose ur credibility..!!
June 18, 2010 at 11:32 AM
1 true blue SOLO hit in 10 years. The guy is def. talented but that is one pathetic box office record!!!
June 18, 2010 at 11:37 AM
1 true blue SOLO hit in 10 years. The guy is def. talented but that is one pathetic box office record!!!
what was the film called ?
June 18, 2010 at 11:44 AM
Shararat!!!
June 18, 2010 at 11:39 AM
the irony is Abhi has to fall back on Karan Johar or Yashraj to give him a hit…Dostana 2 will be his best bet for a commercial success in future…But the abhi fans will never stop riduculing and criticiing these two production houses who are responsible for keeping abhi’s career afloat…
June 18, 2010 at 11:43 AM
I know a SRK fan knows all about the irony of falling back on Yashraj or Johar but actually I don’t believe they’ve kept his career afloat.. his single greatest career moment was still in a Rathnam film or for that matter the RGV Sarkar was also important. And if he had a hit with BnB he also had JBJ.
And we keep criticizing those production houses precisely because we are sincere in our beliefs and don’t start loving those films just because Abhishek does them!
Much as I didn’t start disliking Dil Se or going hysterical over it because SRK was in it or because it was a bomb.
June 18, 2010 at 11:30 AM
RAAVAN
Only director Mani Ratnam could have the dexterity to ascribe the story of The Ramayana to a raw, modernist setting and yet remain faithful to the original story. In Ratnam’s version the mythological characters of yore are supplanted with a Police Inspector ‘Dev’ (Vikram) and his wife Ragini’ (Aishwarya Rai Bachchan) who become the prey of the ruthless Beera (Abhishek Bachchan). Injured and enraged, Beera drags both Dev and Ragini into battle through the deepest ravines of the jungle as their wage a war for survival.
Ratnam puts his actors through the mill in a rigorous shoot which sees them braving the elements. Their most physically challenging roles yet, both Aishwarya and Abhishek give their all, delivering passionate performances, albeit at times appearing to run through a stock catalogue of well practiced expressions. The mud ravaged Aishwaryia alternates between deathly mortification, chin wobbling desperation and coy helplessness, all of which work to great effect in rendering the rain soaked damsel ever lovelier as she is sent plummeting down a cliff side and left to claw her way out of any number of pits and ravines. All this and her beauty is never once dimmed.
As the fearful Beera, Abhishek spends a large part of the film snarling at Aishwarya and while he captures the insanity of a vengeful man, his maniacal musings begin to grate, until we realise that his demeanour is symptomatic of the damaged psyche of a man, wounded at his core.
rating:***
http://www.film4.com/reviews/2010/raavan
June 18, 2010 at 12:13 PM
None of the films in 2010 are remarkable accept rajneeti which surprisely did well at the B.O…Even MNIK was below par which only overseas saved it going “dud”…Raavan is heading towards disaster i wonder what next on the list..non of the stars guarantees success accept and yes accept Amir khan who is simply untouchable .If mangal pandey would have realeased today it would have been thumps-up on the opening day…
June 18, 2010 at 12:14 PM
See this twitter message (how true!!)
Taran Adarash Gives a 4/5 to Housefull and 1.5/ 5 to Ravaan….. And I am sure there are many like Taran in India
We have Mayawati was CM of UP and yes we will keep getting Superhits like Houseful. I am so sick of choices India makes
my fear is people will not understand how good Raavan is…. We as a country didnt understand what President Kalam was.
June 18, 2010 at 12:27 PM
Now this is BS and angoor khatte hain type of statement!
June 18, 2010 at 12:33 PM
If India didn’t appreciate Kalam, how did he become President?
June 18, 2010 at 12:40 PM
LOL Q, saala movie na like karne ke liye Indians kee hee G…d mmarne shuru kardee !!
WTF??
June 18, 2010 at 2:19 PM
Rocky: I wish I were similarly unappreciated…
Ted: agree the Presidency is not determined by a direct election, but then that raises another question: given that the President is elected by legislators, that tweeter is suggesting saying that the aam Indian can’t appreciate him, but that an electorate of professional netas did?! In fact, I would argue the reverse: India’s presidents are generally political insiders (i.e. presidency becomes a reward for serving the party well; e.g. Pratibha Patil); no disrespect is intended, as some have been people of stature (Rajendra Prasad, Zakir Husain, S. Radhakrishnan), BUT Kalam was not a political insider in that sense. The electorate of professional netas brought him in precisely because they thought this choice would go down well with the people. And, it did.
On the issue at hand: If Raavan flops — and it seems likely it will — mujh se zyaada afsoos shaayad hi kisi ko hoga (if the film turns out to be one I like, as has happened with multiple Rathnam films, aur bhi afsoos hoga). But there’s no need to use this as an occasion to throw one’s hands up and piss on one’s own people (not suggesting you are saying that ted, referring to the tweeple here). IF Raavan is a good film that isn’t getting its audience, then we (the industry; the critics; people who write and talk about films) all need to do a better job of promoting the kind of cinema we think should be there; certainly the audience isn’t above critique, but bringing up the category “India”/its politics/Mayawati/society-at-large is just uncalled for.
June 18, 2010 at 2:22 PM
Why didn’t he get the second term? I’ve heard he was not interested because of internal politics.
Those are not my comments, found it interesting in twitter.
June 18, 2010 at 2:26 PM
A lot of presidents (I think) only serve one term. Second, and more important, Kalam was widely perceived to be closer to the BJP — hence when the Congress took over they were NOT keen on having him, and he chose not to fight a battle he couldn’t have won (i.e. by the time of his 2nd term, the electoral arithmetic was against him). The presidency is largely ceremonial, BUT it fulfils certain crucial functions (dismissing state governments, imposing governor’s rule, etc.) so ruling parties would always like “their people” in that position…
June 18, 2010 at 2:36 PM
Q- aap tau united India- pakistan ke President banoge. LOL
PS- read your article on your blog, about India Pakistan in a hurry, was very very well written and will read it again to fully understand.
June 18, 2010 at 12:48 PM
I don’t think president will be elected by the direct public.
June 18, 2010 at 12:34 PM
LOL…whats a statement ??? Basically a statement of loosers….Mayawati is CM of UP because people have voted her to power..Need to respect that fact…
June 18, 2010 at 12:42 PM
Here I agree with you Raj.
June 18, 2010 at 12:45 PM
Those tweets are not to support raavan, just to show Different people, different thoughts. It is hard to satisfy everyone.
I will take Raavna over RNDBj or My name is Khan any day
June 18, 2010 at 1:02 PM
Thats quite understandable…Abhi fans no matter how crap the movie may be( here not saying Raavan is crap…Havent seen the movie to comment on it)
June 18, 2010 at 12:18 PM
It’s admirable that Abhishek is not afraid of doing risky stuff but without Aamir’s script sense, he is more likely to fail than succeed. Examples: D6, JBJ, Drona and now Raavan.
BTW I wasn’t surprised when Aamir dropped out of Lajjo, his idea of cinema is very different from Rathnam’s.
June 18, 2010 at 2:35 PM
His cinematic acumen is inferior than Ratnam’s tho..
June 18, 2010 at 12:18 PM
I dont think the film is that bad that the people are making out of it.
Have to watch it and then make a judgment on it..
June 18, 2010 at 1:20 PM
^Ditto. The Indian critics also over exaggerated over how supposedly bad Sarkar Raj and Delhi 6 were as movies as well. The way the critics carried on you would have thought these movies were the worst to ever be made. I went on my own to watch Sarkar Raj and Delhi 6. I found both movies flawed, but very enjoyable to watch. I enjoyed them. The venom the critics spewed did not match up because both movies were very good in my view.
June 18, 2010 at 12:51 PM
India Today review
Raavan: Boy blunder lost in an epic mess
http://indiatoday.intoday.in/site/Story/102055/Cinema/raavan-boy-blunder-lost-in-an-epic-mess.html
June 18, 2010 at 12:58 PM
The polygraph test has turned me off BIG time from this movie !!
June 18, 2010 at 3:16 PM
I would think it’s preferable to the fire test!
June 18, 2010 at 3:25 PM
you would, but reading of Ramayan is NOT that simple !!
June 18, 2010 at 3:34 PM
I agree completely.. it is not as simple as the orthodoxy would have one believe! The thing is Rocky there is a ‘faith’ one can follow as it is passed down to one which then becomes no more than the power of an existing orthodoxy. But then there is another kind where one questions it, and probes it for all its ambiguities.. I think this approach enriches one.. otherwise one is like the Islamists (and not only these) who lose their religion at the drop of a hat. So the Agnipariksha ought to be deeply problematic. This does not make the Ramayana a lesser work. If anything given the richness of the tradition that gives to us this canonical Ramayana (always inflected through a Brahmin prism.. one forgets this at one’s peril) why should one be so fixated on just one version? I am enamored by the sheer inventiveness of so many of these texts (not just the Ramayana) whenever I approach them. Why be reductive? Why just follow an orthodoxy? and if one is going to do this why blame anyone else for being as inflexible? Fundamentalism arises precisely because of such monomanias. Let’s not be afraid of debate. I am not saying all of this to you necessarily, you’re an old ‘partner-in-crime’ in these matters, and one whose comments I’ve always enjoyed, but as a general matter let’s not be offended so easily! I think getting back to the film that if the polygraph disturbs anyone Rathnam has precisely hit his mark. Sometimes the truth of a work lies in its rejection. I turn away from certain kinds of violence on screen. What scares me is precisely the fact that it does in fact exist.
June 19, 2010 at 10:38 AM
Fuck I have made the word trivialized, travel to 14 year banwaas ! LOL!!
June 18, 2010 at 3:43 PM
Satyam, it is said that the two flaws Ram in otherwise purushotam Ram were Killing of Bali and Agnee Parikhsha.
but if you listen to the various Ram Katha Vachaks they have a whole set of reasons for these acts.
anyways I am not doubting Rathnam’s right to present it any which way he likes , I personally shall not agree if it has been travalized.
June 18, 2010 at 3:45 PM
have a great weekend , got to run !!
June 18, 2010 at 1:05 PM
http://ibnlive.in.com/news/masand-raavan-is-a-bore-of-a-film/124771-8-84.html
Masand: ‘Raavan’ is a bore of a film
June 18, 2010 at 1:15 PM
I understand that some are feeling let down. No one wants to see their fave actor’s movie fail. But if Abhishek had turned down Raavan then he would have been crucified by the media and fans for turning down a Mani Rathnam movie. However why would Abhishek turn down a movie with Rathnam? Mani Rathnam is one of India’s best directors. Rathnam has given Abhishek 2 of his most rich and iconic roles in Yuva and Guru. Yuva and Guru changed Abhishek’s career for the better. So it was a no brainer that Abhishek would eagerly want to sign up for Raavan.
So I don’t see anything out or order in Abhishek’s choice to sign up for Raavan. At the end of the day I think Raavan will become one of his signature movies no matter its box office fate. Raavan’s box office fate was never in Abhishek’s control as he had no control over the movie’s writing, production, or directing. If Raavan fails at the box office then it will be because the screenplay and the movie in general failed to click with the mass audience. It would be unfortunate, but is what it is.
I do agree with the general consensus that Abhishek must be admired for having the courage to do risky movies like JBJ, Delhi 6, and Raavan since audiences in India don’t cotton to these type of movies which are surreal, complex, and go against the grain of the Indian sensibilities. For those who say that Abhishek should be more careful in regards to his career. I’m in agreement with that sentiment only on the grounds that he needs to vastly improve his script sense. Abhishek needs to have a better handle on what will work for the mass audience in India. But so does most actors in Bollywood. It took Aamir Khan many years before he developed great script sense through trial and error.
As far as Abhishek’s current line up of movies(Game, Dum Maaro Dum, KHJJS, Dostana 2, Italian Job, Special Chabbis, etc.). I don’t have any real quibbles with his choices as he is trying to mix it up with a variety of roles and genres. In fact I think the majority of Abhishek’s upcoming movies will fare vastly well at the box office since the majority of these movies are commercial in nature with low to medium sized budgets. I think this will benefit and work for Abhishek. However I still hope that if presented with future opportunities that Abhishek will continue to work with Rathnam, Mehra, Gowariker, etc. I think Abhishek does suits quality cinema and it helps him row as an actor. I hope to see Abhishek balance good commercial cinema with quality(meaningful)cinema. Whatever the fate of Raavan. Abhishek can’t be counted out. Abhishek is a vastly good actor. He still has great potential. I still see much acclaim and success in Abhishek’s future. I’m also still eager and excited to go out to watch Raavan. I’m sure I’ll enjoy Raavan the same way I enjoyed Abhishek’s other current movies: Sarkar Raj, Dostana , Delhi 6. and Paa.
ps. satyam I was finally able to get my message through to post today.
lol
June 18, 2010 at 1:24 PM
Agreed.
I think Abhishek has done great roles and films which might not have clicked.
And please stop bringing Amir into every thing.
He’s 45/46 for crying out loud. After several failures he reached where he is now.
ABjr should carry on in this vein and he’ll definitely make a mark.
What can one say when Housefull is liked and Raavan not.
June 18, 2010 at 2:18 PM
I was not bringing up Aamir as an insult or anything of real relevance. I was just using him as one quick example of how long it takes for actors to learn to recognise what the audience wants and what works for them. I do hope Abhishek improves on this front. But I’m in agreement with you that Abhishek should continue on with mixing it up in his career as it will lead to him making a more consistent mark as an actor. I don’t see much fault with his current line up.
June 18, 2010 at 3:18 PM
yes but that’s the question that is never asked in India.. what does it mean when Housefull works and Dil Se doesn’t?
June 18, 2010 at 3:52 PM
Dil Se should have worked? Why? There was no soul in the movie. Swades, a different thing altogether, I could feel the emotions. No way Dil Se was convincing at all. It was a major disappointment from Mani Ratnam.
June 18, 2010 at 4:42 PM
Disagree.. the problem wasn’t ‘soul’ but a radical script and treatment..
June 18, 2010 at 7:25 PM
There was no audience connect. No basis as to why he leaves a bubbly Preuty Zinta for a very indifferent Manisha Koirala. Sorry it was the biggest disappointment for me. I have no problems with radical script and it’s treatment. Bottomline, it lacked a soul for me and all people who rejected it.
June 18, 2010 at 7:34 PM
He’s always shown as a somewhat strange guy who’s quite enraptured with Manisha as this woman of mystery. It’s a rather old trope in many ways. And he doesn’t leave Zinta because he’s never interested in her. He has Manisha on the mind.
June 18, 2010 at 7:38 PM
Well, it could mean several things.
– the burden of the leading star did in Dil Se, as everyone expected an SRK starrer to be a “romantic” movie like his other famous ones, a la DDLJ, KKHH, DTPH.
– the above also ties in to the importance of proper marketing, which is very hard in India, where most films are sold, and the audience makes its viewing decision, based on the stars involved, not reviews or marketing (a good example is KANK — many people went in thinking, Oh, SRK-Rani in a KJo movie — will be a great romance.)
– if you want to be experimental, better to be so with unknown actors, who don’t have the baggage of their screen image (which they have to carefully nurture to survive or succeed in the industry). If you want the added commercial viability of having “stars”, then you have to tailor the film to their marketable strengths, and be less “experimental.”
– a film that delivers on what it promises (Housefull) maybe considered to be more “honest” than one which doesn’t (Kites; perhaps Raavan)
– different audiences have different sensibilities. Popular works, in any medium, are more accessible to a wider variety of people than those requiring more education or experience. But this does not necessarily mean that the popular work has to be denigrated, as it is still giving a lot of people something that they want.
The bottom line to me is, if you’re working in mass communications (as writers and filmmakers undoubtedly are), you must take the responsibility if you fail to communicate with the masses, and not blame them for being “unworthy” of your genius.
For me personally, if the only USP of Raavan is that it shows Sita to fall in love with Raavan, or shows that Ram isn’t perfect, it will only produce a big yawn from me. This “revision” has been done too many times in Telugu literature for it to hold any novelty for me.
June 18, 2010 at 7:42 PM
SM, using that standard of mass communication we would have been deprived of several fine or very good films all over the globe. I am always thankful that some in every age risk the box office.
On the Ramayana bit not sure what relevance Telugu literature has to a film form as masterful as Rathnam’s, specially here?! Also by that standard what theme do you find in any other film that you watch that you have never encountered in literature?! I am expecting a subversion of the Ramayana not a canonical take on this epic that could rival that of a great novel? Isn’t this a straw man?! But again Rathnam’s film form should entice if nothing else.
Anyway I’m leaving for the film, will pick this up later..
June 18, 2010 at 8:17 PM
Why would we be deprived of fine films? I am only saying that there is no need to wonder why they were not accessible to a larger audience, and conversely, that there is no need to look down on a film that does connect to a larger audience. So there is no need to frame a question like, “What does it mean when Housefull works and Dil Se doesn’t?” in any but financial terms, since the very word “works” only refers to the box office. One may equally well ask, “What does it mean when Housefull works and KI doesn’t?” The difference is pricing and cost, and people have learned that lesson, hence the reason why Housefull “works”, without being in any way different artistically. So what it “means” in the Dil Se context is, as I have said above, that a filmmaker making an offbeat film should handle the finances accordingly, and believe that the presence of a star is enough to compensate, if the film doesn’t fit the star’s market strengths.
As for the reference to Telugu literature, I said that was my personal take. Someone for whom that idea is fresh or new may take more away from the film than I would, since for me the idea itself would be already somewhat hackneyed.
Enjoy your viewing experience!
June 19, 2010 at 1:34 AM
I actually look down on a critical apparatus (to dignify it greatly) that judges Dil Se and Housefull using the very same yardstick. And I have never confused art with democracy. You are certainly right about the financial side of things but what does one do of the subject and formal vision of a filmmaker require the film to be made on a certain scale. What if someone told Orson Welles not to spend tons of money on Citizen Kane and make it on a shoestring budget? A box office failure in its time, now judged the greatest film of all time by many! Hitchcock’s Vertigo was also a bit of a damp squib at the time, today another ‘greatest’ kind of film. What am I getting at? Not that every box office failure can be so rescued but without the right critical tools one is totally at sea anyway. It is always hard to predict what will stand the test of time or reinvented in another age but whatever the age Dil Se has a lot better chance than Housefull.
I understood what you meant, I just don’t find the Telugu literature example valid. For one cinema offers audio-visual pleasures that are other to those of literature. But secondly I could pretty much dismiss every film ever made in every industry of the world using the argument that it is not ‘ahead’ of literature with your very criterion. I am not exaggerating at all. here’s an example — there’s nothing Bergman does that you couldn’t get out of Strindberg or Kierkegaard. There’s nothing Fellini does that couldn’t be derived from Fellini. There’s nothing in Antonioni that couldn’t be extracted from a host of European novelists. On and on. In other words one wouldn’t need cinema at all! What about the visual grammar the medium offers? It’s not just that a story is being told by way of visuals, it is assuredly, in most instances anyway, but the fact that we ‘receive’ the same differently when we read as opposed to when we view it. The Greeks used the same myths hundreds of times in their drama. Just those little twists they brought about mattered. No one expected them to offer enormously important alternate takes on those myths everytime they attempted these!
As for the negative reviews most people actually haven’t discussed the Ramayana at all, they’ve simply dismissed the film.
June 18, 2010 at 1:50 PM
Eire,
You are right and Raavan is a very good project, atleast on paper.
It SEEMS to have gone wrong somewhere in execution. Having not seen the film, ideally should not be commenting on it. But, have heard enough opinions to atleast appreciate the film has not succeded in having a large section of public and critics into ‘buying into’ the film. It might still please some but leave a large majority feeling ‘unfulfilled’ and that would be a failure of sorts. At this stage of his career Abhi can ill afford these high profile failures.
June 18, 2010 at 2:27 PM
Just gauging the reviews it seems that the execution of Raavan failed to click with the mass audience because of the screenplay and the pace wee the movie’s undoing. That is the gist that has been written. I will see the movie for myself to suss it out. Though I have enjoyed all of Rathnam’s Hindi movies(and even some of his Tamil movies). So I’m sure I’ll enjoy Raavan. It’s true that no actor needs high profile failures. But I indeed believe that Abhishek will survive all of this as he has done in the past. I have no doubts. If other actors are currently surviving high profile failures then there is no reason to think any different with Abhishek. I don’t see much alarm or much to worry about with his line up at this juncture.
June 18, 2010 at 2:32 PM
Very well summarized Eire.
June 18, 2010 at 3:25 PM
I personally think Eire the problems with this are all ideological.. I just heard from someone whose opinion I have great respect for that this is a very fine film but equally a very subversive one..
June 18, 2010 at 7:43 PM
You keep bringing up this “ideological” charge. I am not sure to what you are referring. Are you referring to a different take on the Ramayana, or to film industry politics regarding Mani Ratnam? If it is the former, anything that seeks to be subversive needs to lay a proper groundwork for that subversion. It is not enough to present a different interpretation merely for the sake of difference. Consider this: If this film were called something other than “Raavan”, would it have fared any better? If not (because of the pacing, weak storyline and weak performances, as several reviews have mentioned), then the problem cannot be ideological, but rests with the quality of the film itself.
The fact that the Tamil version is also facing the same kind of criticisms, to my mind shows that the problems are with the film as a film, not with its ideology. (We had discussed long before the release about how the alternate Ramayana tradition in Tamil Nadu might work in the film’s favor, while it might be more problematic in Hindi.)
June 19, 2010 at 1:22 AM
I am referring to the fact (as always) that Hindi multiplex audiences are not kind on a film that subverts their ‘values’ or ‘lifestyle choices’. The Ramayana is not the issue here. It is what Rathnam does in most of his films to the whole ‘institution’ of middle class mores.
On the reviews I could point to tons of important films from all over the world including India that were also dismissed by the critics. Doesn’t necessarily prove as much. Mera Naam Joker is today RK’s biggest moneyspinner, bigger than all of his other hits in reruns. But at the time it was mauled so savagely and was such a flop that in some ways Raj Kapoor never quite recovered from the setback. Failures drove Guru Dutt to suicide and today many of his films are considered among the very greatest.
Also I’m not sure about you but I wasn’t expecting an interpretation here to parallel the Kamban Ramayana!
Finally, in my view certain kinds of films are represented as ‘boring’, ‘weak in script’ etc etc precisely when people find it hard to absorb them for other reasons. Meanwhile dozens of films that become hits with garbage scripts and equally poor performances are never called up for the same reason. Ideology is what veils itself. I have seen very many serious efforts that do not work being criticized on these seemingly ‘neutral’ grounds.
June 18, 2010 at 3:18 PM
great response Eire.. and yes I would ALWAYS urge Abhishek to accept any kind of Rathnam film..
June 18, 2010 at 1:41 PM
Agreed. I love if he works with Mani again!!
June 18, 2010 at 1:55 PM
Sandy’s review:
http://sandhyai.blogspot.com/2010/06/raavan-review.html
Fair review, I would say. I think there is a common theme running thru most negative and even some positive reviews. Beera’s character has gone somewhere wrong in conception and execution.
June 18, 2010 at 2:20 PM
It’s gone totally wrong imo..
June 18, 2010 at 1:56 PM
All this once again brings the question of BO economics vis-a-vis mainstream-vs-offbeat movies. If a director knows that the movie is not mainstream, why spend so much and ruin the star’s saleability for future projects. In 6 weeks, we have seen 3 movies which were all offbeats. I wont call Kites mainstream, just cause RR took the whole language risk, as well as taking a foreign heroine for the whole movie, etc.
Pricing/Cost for both Kites and Raavan has definitely not been sensibly calibrated. Rajneeti on the other hand with a large canvas of stars, was priced right. Even if it had not clicked massively, it still wudve recovered the costs and the actors wudve been spared.
Ranbir must be smiling (or blowing smokerings) after looking at the fate of Kites/Raavan.
June 18, 2010 at 2:04 PM
http://www.filmjournal.com/filmjournal/content_display/reviews/specialty-releases/e3ic0c203644bbc3d5f8511bf80bafc5a40
Abhishek Bachchan, best known for Michael Douglas-style urbane cosmopolitans in bespoke suits, but who, as the charismatic and possibly sociopathic tribal leader Beera, plays a manic-depressive Col. Kurtz who hears voices and has to hit himself in the head to try to oust them. As undeniably talented as Michael Douglas is, it’s hard to picture him nailing this difficult, teetering-on-outré role, which only works if the demon is confident and conflicted simultaneously, and recognizably human without the actor beating his chest about it. This may be Bachchan’s most accomplished performance to date.
June 18, 2010 at 3:21 PM
fantastically summed up.. once again note how certain kinds of reviewers have been praising Abhishek a great deal…
June 18, 2010 at 2:04 PM
It is interesting to see Abhishek’s acting in raavn is getting compleetly different opinions. In tweets, seeing many people liked his act, not movie.
June 18, 2010 at 3:22 PM
the idea that everyone has disliked the performance is myth. But what happens unfortunately is that once there’s enough negativity and a certain hysteria is generated people start overlooking the other kind of review.
June 18, 2010 at 7:32 PM
i don’t know which world you folks are living in, but the movie is getting pure bad reviews and WOM. Even Hrithik fans can pull off a few reviews/tweets from the internet to show Kites is extremely liked. It won’t make it the truth. These reviews are one in a hundred kind of deal, and pretty sure it will take few hours to dig a positive one from the internet. Appreciate how hard ppl on this forum are trying to do some damage control, but in vain.
June 18, 2010 at 2:26 PM
another chance for getting a solo hit for abhi seems to go down the drain.
Mani ratnam is no doubt a great director but mostly with regional cinema. if he needs to get a film successful at an all india level, he needs to move out of his comfort mode (more or less every film of his is inclined to a heavy south indian touch). all his hindi films except Guru have failed at the indian box office.
June 18, 2010 at 2:30 PM
Guru was Rathnam’s most commercial Hindi movie which is why it worked with the mass audience to become a hit.
June 18, 2010 at 3:24 PM
It has nothing to do with ‘regional’. Many of his high profile Tamil films have also failed. Not sure why this point is so hard to register for most people despite endless repetition. Is it necessary to dismiss him as the ‘regional’ guy? Rathnam has done better in HIndi than Bhardwaj. How come no one calls the latter ‘regional’?
June 18, 2010 at 2:33 PM
Guys can we stop with the elities attitude. Just because the public doesnt like what you and I may prefer that doesnt mean that they are some how making the wrong choice or that they are stupid. The audience likes what the audience likes and everyone should respect that. The same public loved 3I and other “good” films.
I feel bad for Abhi because I feel he is a talented guy, but I too fear that he starting to run out chances. Working with “prestigous” directors is fine but at some point you have too deliver a boxoffice hit. If he can’t deliver a hit soon I still think he will have a long career but maybe along the lines of a Shashi Kapoor as a second hero.
June 18, 2010 at 2:49 PM
Yes, Abhishek and other actors should deliver hits. But no actor of any caliber can make a movie a hit if the movie fails to click or work with the mass audience. An actor can deliver a great opening for a movie but if the movie does not click with the audience then its going to quickly fizzle out. We have seen this happen many times to other actors last year and this year!
June 18, 2010 at 2:33 PM
just watched raavan…..oh man !!!! paisa vasool !!!!
went with low expectation after such tepid reviews. But to the contrary a very fine movie. Excellent performance from Abhi, Ash and vikram. Govinda & Nikhil surprises. But Priaymani with a very short appearence put a long lasting mark. She was so beautiful & charmings a village belle. Excellent BGM and Cinematography. I have never seen such great visuals in a bollywood movie ever. First half was good but second just brilliant with a great climax. honestly i enjoyed this movie more that Dil se, Yuva and Guru. Details review later…
June 18, 2010 at 2:36 PM
and please for god sake dont pay obituary for a movie without even seeing it. I just loved it and all my friends also enjoyed immensely. evening show had 90% occupancy in NCR
June 18, 2010 at 2:38 PM
wow, that’s good to hear…
June 18, 2010 at 2:42 PM
That is indeed good news to hear. I’m glad you enjoyed the movie hector.
June 18, 2010 at 3:26 PM
good to hear Hector..
June 18, 2010 at 2:38 PM
hector, nice to see positive feedback.
June 18, 2010 at 2:39 PM
Hector, Are you AB’s fan?
June 18, 2010 at 2:44 PM
I went to Satyam, chennai. hindi is allocated 3 shows. Got the ticket only previous day. Tamil was houseful. Most of the audience got tired of the film & his performance. Started making catcalls & funny jokes on him.
Agree on Priyamani tho. She was great here.
June 18, 2010 at 2:51 PM
That’s fine. In Hindi version, it seems they have experimented his character and mannerisms. That didn’t go well with audience.
June 18, 2010 at 2:45 PM
i am an aamir fan. Honestly i enjoyed the movie and not just any particular actor/actress. Abhishek should be lauded for taking a bold step and doing this kind of cinema. * Spoler alert* Ironically the ending is similar to Kites but the impact is 100 times better than kites. Audience was spellbound when abhi fell from the cliff and the same audience were laughing when HR jumped at the end in Kites.
June 18, 2010 at 2:49 PM
and ted….liking a movie immensely does not implies you should be a fan of that star…..
June 18, 2010 at 2:52 PM
I know, why I’ve asked whether Abhi’s fan is just to clear off some myths.
June 18, 2010 at 3:36 PM
Bachans are not afraid to try different and rishky but all we hear from srk fans is abhi did this and that where as srk specialty is to do remake of devdas or don or doing romantis triangle like KHNH…atleast abhi is doing rishky project….grow-up.
desparate times takes desperate measures and does happen to any stars…one day it will happen to srk when he will do a remake of black or paa and wrongly back-fires……..
June 22, 2010 at 2:11 AM
Yes abhi is doing risky projects..Ask mani ratnam,Goldi behl,Jp Dutta,RGV and others who have lost millions…
I mean there is a limit to defend somebody…
June 18, 2010 at 3:43 PM
http://www.deccanchronicle.com/entertainment/beauty-behold-vague-threads-489
Deccan Chronicle
June 18, 2010 at 4:14 PM
Raavan’ has occurred, and if early reviews are those who believe that this is one of the movies that should be among the highest grossers of 2010.
http://www.apakistannews.com/raavan-reviews-raavan-movie-190173
June 18, 2010 at 4:14 PM
May be it is only me or is there something wrong with the reviews? I just saw this film in London and not only I liked the film, I saw positive reaction from fellow watchers as well. And hall was 80% full. What’s going on………..
June 18, 2010 at 5:02 PM
Positive reaction in London with 80% capacity? That is good. The reviews abroad have been more positive towards Raavan.
June 18, 2010 at 5:35 PM
In twitter many people from Dubai/Muscat , enjoyed the movie. They said crowd reaction was positive.
June 18, 2010 at 4:21 PM
Saw raavan first day first show in my city with family …. that too after taking few hours off from work, that tells how much i love to see abhi on screen.
I went to the movie after reading almost all published reviews with zero expectations and the movie did not disappoint me at all. I just loved all lead actors performances and abhi is excellent as beera.
In spite of great performances from all actors, great music and great visuals somehow mani couldn’t package it well. I think may be mani should have developed the ram-sita story in the beginning and told the story in a linear fashion with kidnapping at the interval. Just a thought.
I am planning to watch ‘omrao jaan tonight, that is the only abhi movie I haven’t seen yet. yep, thats right I have seen everything else!!!!!
June 18, 2010 at 5:00 PM
thanks for the views JV..
June 18, 2010 at 4:29 PM
Well, I actually don’t mind him much as an actor. He’s fairly likeable in many films I have watched of his.
but the truth is he gained a soft corner in the hearts of many people who had sympathy for him after so many flops he delivered early in his career, that they were waiting desperately for any kind of success for him. it all started with Yuva where he was critically appreciated by many critics.. and all hell broke loose for these guys who were favouring this underdog.. so much that he became an instant favourite with some.. and with few successes in 2005, media started comparing him with Amitabh bachchan’s earliest phase in career.. Yuva was even compared with Amitabh’s Zanjeer.
but whatever happened after that proved it was too soon to call abhi a star.. coz apart from Guru and a couple of other multi starrer hits, Abhi never delieverd anything substantial.. maybe the big projects he was involved with didnt deliver good films but then it affected him the most.
so its just not wise to have high expectations from this guy. he can deliver once in a while and than can satisfy people who have no hopes from him
June 18, 2010 at 5:07 PM
chetan bhagat tweets: (he liked raavan)
chetan_bhagat I saw Raavan. I liked it.
chetan_bhagat Some visuals are truly world class. Performances good. Given the ambitious nature, some portions may jar to typical bollywood fare seekers.
chetan_bhagat But overall Mani is a genius. I liked it more than Guru, but that’s just me. And yeah, nobody told me to write this.
chetan_bhagat And I find shooting star anchor hunt too much, Raavan team must have killed themselves shooting this. Well done all! Gnite!
June 18, 2010 at 5:30 PM
From all the reviews it definitely seems that the film is pitched far more to western sensibilities of movie making than those of Indian and it’s probably to be expected with such a short running time for such an inate subject to the Indian mindset. Western audiences and reviewers don’t know the different versions of the mythology and are also used to joining the dots where story weaving comes into play. Infact it might do better with non Indian viewers who just see a kidnap thriller in a rustic settings.
As for the review Abhishek’s getting I tend to expect them as I’ve said before he’s like marmite you either love him or hate him acting wise especially if your a big fan of the theatrical performances of Bwood cinema. The tone of his performances will always throw people. I think by going by all the reviews I’m going to love the film and the performances.
June 18, 2010 at 7:22 PM
Ju..st enjoyed watching raavan and ash was fabulos and mani has provided an memoriable epic…here in birminghampeople were revving after the film and fact is it was packed screen.just luved it man
my message to people is….just go n watch——–Raavan!
June 18, 2010 at 7:34 PM
good to hear.. thanks!
June 18, 2010 at 8:06 PM
Telegraph India – Raavan: An epic disappointment
http://www.telegraphindia.com/1100619/jsp/entertainment/story_12580783.jsp
June 18, 2010 at 8:34 PM
http://chin512.wordpress.com/2010/06/19/raavan-is-brave-attempt-film-review/
Raavan is a Brave Attempt – Film Review
However the film is not bad as portrayed by most of the media, news channels and honorary critics. The film is definitely worth a watch. I do not know what were the critics expecting from this movie but if anyone had to make a different adaptation of Ramayana, this was the way to do it. Else Barjatyas adapted Ramayana for Hum Sath Sath Hain and so did Ramanand Sagar for TV and Manoj Kumar for his Kalyug aur Ramayan. I think Mani Ratnam has taken a brave step especially by showing the ending shot when Sita screams for the dying Raavan.
June 19, 2010 at 1:34 AM
this is a useful passage..
June 18, 2010 at 9:39 PM
Saw Raavan. Loved it. More later.
June 19, 2010 at 1:54 AM
Taran has 79 crores for Rajneeti:
http://www.bollywoodhungama.com/trade/top5/index.html
June 19, 2010 at 6:57 AM
http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/news/news-by-industry/et-cetera/Movie-Review-Raavan-a-feast-for-the-senses-/articleshow/6067604.cms
Abhishek uses his voice, physicality, eyes and smile to create a twisted world of inescapable doom for his character.
June 19, 2010 at 8:27 AM
As per Twitter from Raavan promotion team:
Tamil ravanan has already been declared a hit.
June 19, 2010 at 8:36 AM
Ted, did you watch the film? Any thoughts?
June 19, 2010 at 9:07 AM
not yet.
June 19, 2010 at 8:32 AM
BoC:
Box Office: Raavan opening day collections below expectation
HETAL ADESARA 19 June , 2010
MUMBAI: Mani Ratnam’s Raavan has had a poor opening day at the box office. The movie was released in three versions – Hindi (Raavan), Tamil (Raavanan) and Telugu (Villain). The Hindi version of the movie has done net collections of Rs 55 million (Rs 5.50 crore) on day one across India.
The Friday morning and afternoon shows had a poor response with average occupancy levels ranging between 20 – 40 per cent in smaller centers and around 40 – 60 per cent in centers like Mumbai and Pune.
As compared to the opening day collections of recent films like Raajneeti, Kites and Housefull, Raavan has proved to be a damp squib for the industry. While Raajneeti’s opening day net collections were Rs 105 million, Kites’ was Rs 104 million and that of Housefull was Rs 90 million.
It now remains to be seen how this Abhishek Bachchan – Aishwarya Rai Bachchan starrer holds fort at the box office during the weekend.
June 19, 2010 at 9:07 AM
Rangan tears apart abhi’s perf. in his review:
“It’s tempting to think what a better actress, one less prone to dainty posturing, might have accomplished with this character, but Aishwarya, to her credit, at least, doesn’t frustrate you to the extent that her real-life husband does. The most baffling aspect of Raavan is Abhishek Bachchan’s embodiment of the eponymous villain. He has a superb scene where, after letting Ragini go in a fit of weakness, he imagines her in his clutches again and shoots at her, just to prove to himself that he’s still got his edge. He’s as still as death, his face a stony mask. The effect is chilling.
But elsewhere? Imagine Toshiri Mifune in a Noh-styled Kurosawa drama imbued with the gesticulations of a silent-film scoundrel, and hissing like a rattlesnake making furious love to a tambourine – and you have the general idea. (Bachchan’s scenes are often shot with a jittery camera, possibly to highlight how unhinged he is, but this only accentuates how off-putting the performance is.) If the attempt was to be crowd-pleasing in the mythical (or even masala) sense while staying true to character, he might have looked closer at costar Ravi Kishan, who plays Beera’s loyal brother. The latter, with half the effort, achieves twice the effect.”
June 19, 2010 at 9:09 AM
The performance seems to be extracting extreme reactions…either hit or miss
June 19, 2010 at 9:41 AM
jay, have u seen it? where is ur review?
June 19, 2010 at 9:57 AM
Not yet seen it…planning to watch it tonight or tomorrow night
June 19, 2010 at 9:09 AM
http://www.totalfilmy.com/feature/20100619/raavan_wins_battle_kfcc-29686.html
Raavan wins the battle with KFCC
June 19, 2010 at 9:13 AM
http://www.greatandhra.com/ganews/viewnews.php?id=21735&cat=1&scat=4
63% Theatres In Aishwarya Rai’s Grip
It seems dubbing cinema getting many screens is very rare
June 19, 2010 at 9:38 AM
day 1 business reports are coming in from different sources. BOC 5.5 crs BOI 5.75 crs
Not a good show compared to Rajneeti and Kites.
My guess is this will do 16cr weekend and about 22cr first week.
June 19, 2010 at 9:39 AM
Raavan First Day Business
Saturday 19th June 2010 14.30 IST
Boxofficeindia.Com Trade Network
The Hindi version Raavan collected around 5.75 crore nett on day one. Business in all circuits was pretty low. The film was helped a bit by some upper end multiplexes where the volume of screenings was heavy but most of India recorded dull collections. Gujarat, UP, Bihar, CP Berar, CI and Rajasthan had poor collections.
The South was comparatively better in terms of occupancies but there overall collections were affected by the regional versions of Raavan which meant the audience had a choice as to which version to watch.
The negative reports are likely to mean big falls on Monday. There may even be a drop on Saturday with even Sunday not likely show a big jump which happens with most films. The weekend numbers should come in the 16-17 crore nett range. Overall the film may not even cross the 15 crore distributor share in its whole run.
June 19, 2010 at 9:41 AM
what are figures for Raavan for first two days?
20 cr gross for friday worldwide.
http://twitter.com/parullxx
June 19, 2010 at 9:51 AM
some good news. BOC has updated the first day business… its 6cr now.
June 19, 2010 at 10:04 AM
Abhifans to abhishek–> Intezaar kab tak hum karenge bhala tumhe pyaar kabtak karenge bhala
June 19, 2010 at 10:05 AM
RAAVAN grosses 20 crores worldwide on opening day
June 19, 2010 07:08:18 PM IST
Bollywood Trade News Network
Reliance BIG Pictures and Madras Talkies’ RAAVAN seems to have got an excellent opening at the box office. It has grossed Rs 20 crores worldwide on the opening day from its three versions- Hindi (RAAVAN), Tamil (RAAVANAN) and Telugu (VILLAIN).
RAAVAN is India’s first film to have released worldwide in Hindi, Tamil and Telugu language simultaneously.
The film has opened in 2200 screens worldwide on 18th June in all its three versions.
Directed by Mani Ratnam, the film is a modern-day version and a loose adaptation of the Indian epic Ramayana, in which Sita, the wife of Lord Rama, was abducted by the demon (Rakshasa) king of Lanka, Ravana. The film’s score and soundtrack is composed by A. R. Rahman.
http://www.glamsham.com/movies/scoops/10/jun/19-raavan-grosses-20-crores-worldwide-on-opening-day-061021.asp
June 19, 2010 at 10:10 AM
Raavan (2010)
Director: Mani Ratnam
Time Out rating ****
Average user rating
No reviews Movie review
From Time Out London
India’s most intelligent and respected director, Tamilian Ratnam’s latest bilingual (Hindi/Tamil) film is solid and superior Bollywood entertainment. The bastard Beera (Bachchan) kidnaps the ‘arrogant and fearless’ Ragini (Rai-Bachchan), wife of no-nonsense cop Dev (Vikram). On one level, the plot is dosa-thin: will Dev rescue Ragini safely? But this is a modern update on the revered Hindu epic Sanskrit text ‘The Ramayana’ (c.300 BC). Ratnam’s characterisation kicks in after the first ‘chase and thrills’ hour, giving us a feisty female protagonist who has to question her perception of her captor as either ‘raavan (demon) or Robin Hood’. Performances attract admiration, Oscar-winner A R Rahman’s energetic rustic tunes charm and the cinematography of a monsoonal rural India is stunning. Unlike its mythological evil namesake, this ‘Raavan’ is ravishingly good.
Author: Anil Sinanan 2010-06-18 10:59:05
Time Out London Issue 2078: 17 – 23 June, 2010
Looks like this film will be a success in overseas,,,
——————————————————————————–
June 19, 2010 at 10:14 AM
“Looks like this film will be a success in overseas,,,”
Yes. It is going to beat Avataar records everywhere!!
June 19, 2010 at 10:16 AM
jeevcy stop being your usual annoying self just for once. Have you seen the movie to talk about it so much.
June 19, 2010 at 10:16 AM
Are you truly as stupid as you sound? Chill
June 19, 2010 at 10:33 AM
not as stupid to love a superflopstar just because he is the son of Bachchan Sr.
June 19, 2010 at 10:47 AM
Jeevcy, here are some points to ponder over:
1)A film’s worth is not just reducible to the box office or its initial reviews. If you do not think this self-evident I really believe you need greater exposure to the medium and its history.
2)Whatever I believe about Abhishek no one has to buy it. You are quite free to consider me deluded on this matter also. Perhaps I just have terrible taste that I consider Abhishek a good actor or a star with great screen presence.
But your going after me (or others) again and again won’t change anyone’s opinion. For years I went through a blog where then were a dozen like you attacking every single word I said on Abhishek. So bullying me into shutting up is, safe to say, not an option! I don’t really see the point of continuing in this direction. You can put up all the reviews that rip Abhishek, all the box office reports that fairly or unfairly ridicule its box office performance, but you don’t have to become a Nazi who cannot tolerate the slightest dissent on this matter!
Rangan’s review on the film is the classic example of everything criticism ought to be and this also neatly dovetails with my overall point here. He too has not liked the film, he too has disliked Abhishek in it but consider how well done his piece is in grappling with what the film is about.
The rest is grade 2 name-calling stuff. I refer here to some of the other comments also.
June 19, 2010 at 11:42 AM
Satyam, Rangan has given a 4 star rating for Raavan.
http://baradwajrangan.wordpress.com/2000/01/01/star-ratings/
But his review suggests he has not liked the movie or the performance.
http://baradwajrangan.wordpress.com/2010/06/19/review-raavan/
That review contradicts the ratings itself.
June 19, 2010 at 11:54 AM
I made a bit of an overstatement there.. didn’t mean he was dismissing the movie or anything, just that he was ‘mixed’ on many aspects of it.. surprised with the 4 star rating but it’s clear that I misread where he was coming from.. he does mean to endorse the film..
June 19, 2010 at 11:50 AM
This was already posted in the other thread — he has mauled the abhi and ash performances, but it is clear from the review that he thinks quite highly of the film…
June 19, 2010 at 10:45 AM
tyler….I think u have forgotten that this is the same joke mr.satyam was living on whenever one used to bring MNIK overseas collection into discussion.
all said and done MNIK is the biggest grosser overseas and raavan is heading towards a big failure based on initial figures.
June 19, 2010 at 10:52 AM
Not that I expect honesty from folks like yourself but that is a gross misrepresentation of my position.. incidentally I haven’t introduced overseas numbers here either.. but yeah I doubt I will be talking about Indonesia week 8 and Syria week 7.
Incidentally I think I gave one of the better reviews to MNIK but hey let’s not confuse anyone with the facts!
June 19, 2010 at 11:00 AM
quinqart ,
as i can remember you and other guy were towing the collection of MNIK .
June 19, 2010 at 11:13 AM
Vijay, let me give you my honest perspective of Raavan overseas BO
1. It is NOT going to crossover by any stretch of imagination.
2. It is NOT going to succeed with the Indian diaspora as it is not a NRI movie
if people still keep saying it is going to do well overseas, I just give my POV. I used similar words that Satyam used to use for MNIK. Nothing wrong with it.
Satyam, I do not agree that you have not mocked MNIK overseas collections in a similar way to what I did.
Also, please note any name calling was never initiated by me. I am surprised you did not protest when I was at the receiving end. Is it because I am not optimistic about Raavan as much as others are?
Let me also tell you I am very neutral on my views of Abhishek Bachchan. I loved Bluffmaster as compared to Guru or Dostana. I consider Yuva Abhi’s best performance till date, though I did not like the movie that much. But it is just that I find commentary on Abhi on this site totally biased.
June 19, 2010 at 11:14 AM
Oh I dd mock MNIK overseas collections but what were the contexts? I would urge you to dig up those comments..
June 19, 2010 at 11:29 AM
Satyam, here’s one.
http://satyamshot.wordpress.com/2010/04/15/paathshala-phoonk-2-prince-ongoing-and-other-box-office-uselessness/#comment-47537
June 19, 2010 at 11:31 AM
Here’s what you said Satyam. If that ain’t mocking, nothing is.
“Shezad, keep me posted on Indonesia week 16 and Egypt week 31 for MNIK. But internationally the Avatar record is in danger. No doubt about it. The 3I comparison is foolish anyway. Who looks at the Indian gross? Holland week 42 is what I’m interested in.”
June 19, 2010 at 11:56 AM
yes but you haven’t looked at the overall context.. when the film didn’t do well in India some of the SRK fans went on a tear looking for every last penny of overseas gross.. the gross was good enough on its own but clearly there was some Aamir anxiety here coupled with the desire to have the Indian deficit made up by the overseas one.. not sure what’s so hard to understand here.. it is not at all comparable to many of your statements where you’re more or less attacking people for being optimistic about the box office at any level or having a good word to say about the movie!
June 19, 2010 at 11:26 AM
jeevcy you r really funny
abhi is better actor then akshay,hrithik, any day
and they r better stars,, and that is a fact
June 19, 2010 at 11:35 AM
better actor is a subjective one. Whether Abhi is a better actor than Hrithik is highly debatable. Bigger star you can quantify by BO numbers.
June 19, 2010 at 11:58 AM
not for me evidently.. I might take Abhishek over Aamir also as a star-actor.. I would take Abhishek over Amitabh in certain situations.. everything is debatable.. so why are you trying to shut it off?
June 19, 2010 at 12:06 PM
you will still remain in the minority.
Also, I have a feeling you are unable to distinguish between screen presence and acting. Rajkumar had a great screen presence, but was a non actor. Abhishek has a great screen presence, but is not a brilliant actor made out to be. Aamir does not have a great screen presence.
Screen presence is something someone is born with, cannot work hard to develop screen presence. A husky voice definitely helps.
June 19, 2010 at 12:11 PM
I must admit my cinematic experience is rather limited and I do tend to confuse screen presence with acting…
June 19, 2010 at 12:46 PM
i’m not even a fan of abhishek, but i have enough gray matter to know he’s leagues ahead of hrithik as an actor. people have to know that by now. forget debatable, its as unequivocally clear as night follows day, IMO. just take a look at the body of work by both actors. abhishek has given great performances in “yuva”, guru”, “sarkar” and sarkar raj”.
hrithik obviously CAN act, but as an actor, i find him quite overrated. yeah, he’s gorgeous and is much more commercially viable than abhishek. but let’s take a look at his performances, shall we?: ok, he was excellent in “jodhaa-akbar”. i’ll give him that. i’ll be magnanimous in saying that he was really good in “koi mil gaya” as well. but what else? nothing much, really.
if you add his performances in “lakshya”, “mission kashmir”, “fiza”, etc, then ALL bets are off. i’ll just go ahead and include abhishek’s performances in “bluffmaster”, “delhi-6″, “paa”, “umrao jaan”, “bunty aur babli”, etc. forget about box-office, there is NO question who’s the superior, more versatile actor.
June 19, 2010 at 12:59 PM
I didn’t know that Dilse was flop until few days back. If I have name some of the SRK movies Swadesh, Dilse tops though they are flops.
I can’t even remember any of Akshay Kuamar’s except khakee though he is giving so many hits.
But for Abhishek most of his movies after Yuva are different, long lasting.. I liked his JBJ also
June 19, 2010 at 1:14 PM
“forget debatable, its as unequivocally clear as night follows day, IMO”
how can it be unequivocal when it is just your opinion? That is the problem I have with the commentary here on SS. It is highly debatable, else we would not be debating it. I don’t rate Abhi’s performance in Guru as highly as you do. Neither has Hrithik done anything pathbreaking in his career s far. It is very debatable as to who is a better actor and it cannot just be opinion of one person or group.
June 19, 2010 at 1:41 PM
to jeevcy: “how can it be unequivocal when it is just your opinion?”
i was only speaking for myself hence the “IMO” at the end of the sentence. i was wasn’t stating it as fact. just so you know,,,
June 19, 2010 at 1:45 PM
i rephrase: i wasn’t stating it as fact
June 22, 2010 at 2:18 AM
Abhishkes. performance in D6 is very bad…He was good in Bluff master,yuva and Guru ..I liked him in Run too..
June 22, 2010 at 2:22 AM
I tend to agree with Rakesh Mehra on his performance!
June 19, 2010 at 10:19 AM
“Looks like this film will be a success in overseas,,,”
Yes. It is going to beat Avataar records everywhere!!
jeevcy you need to calm down and stop jumping into wrong concluson
go and watch the movei and decide….
June 19, 2010 at 10:35 AM
Its so amazing that the indian medei are slautering raavan while there counter-part america and uk media are loving the movie.
The Los Angeles Times described Raavan as an entertainer. “Raavan has Bollywood glamour aplenty, with the lovely if occasionally dramatically challenged Aishwarya Bachchan, Mr. Bachchan’s wife, playing the Sita stand-in. The real star, though, is Mr. Ratnam, a talented visual storyteller who directs action crisply and fills the screen with striking images,” it reported.
The praises don’t end there. Praising the film and its maker Mani Ratnam, Variety reported, “A cop and self-styled Robin Hood face off in a wild and brawny contest in Mani Ratnam’s bullets-and-dance spectacle Raavan,” adding, “ Fabulous locales and lush surroundings provide a great backdrop, with Ratnam carefully matching the work of two cinematographers, Santosh Sivan and V. Manikandan. Hollywood Reporter also described Raavan as a Pan-Indian saga with epic sweep, intense emotion and gorgeous images.
Well, it will interesting to see how Raavan fairs at the box office, after having received mixed response from Indian media and rave reviews from American media. Watch out for this film featuring Abhishek Bachchan, Aishwarya Bachchan and Vikram!
http://entertainment.oneindia.in/bollywood/news/2010/raavan-america-praised-heavens-190610.html
June 20, 2010 at 1:37 AM
“Its so amazing that the indian medei are slautering raavan while there counter-part america and uk media are loving the movie.” – but those people went ga-ga over Kites also if i’m not wrong! in any case, despite all the negativities around RAAVAN – i beleive that it is not being slaughtered as mercilessly as kites….
June 19, 2010 at 11:29 AM
huh… too much of discussion on raavan today.
Whatever, I will hopefully be going to watch this one tomorrow – at least for the visuals and cinematography; which looks to be the best since Dil se.. at least thats what even the negative reviews suggest
June 19, 2010 at 12:12 PM
@satyam
>Rangan’s review on the film is the classic example of everything criticism ought to be and this also neatly dovetails with my overall point here. He too has not liked the film
I did not get that impression at all. He wasn’t impressed with AB’s acting though he mentioned a couple of places where he was actually impressed.
But ‘not liked the film’ is not what I gathered.
There were things he liked and things he didn’t.
To be fair to you, you did have kind words for MNIK when you reviewed it, but not so regarding its BO, where you (and others) were quite harsh, and absolutely rubbished its oversees success.
Is it only in India or is it a worldwide phenomenon that there is such schadenfruede when a film fails.
All the threads here about Raavan are resonating with it.
It was the same with MNIK.
In fact there is no sensible comment from those who didn’t like it. Is there nothing else in the film apart from AB? Their comment starts and ends there.
I’m hoping that this is all a ‘created’ frenzy and when it has died down, when the dust has settled we’ll see that the film picks up.
June 19, 2010 at 12:17 PM
I stand to correction on the Rangan piece and in fact revisited it..
On MNIK I still consider it’s Indian performance nothing to talk about. The overseas performance I dismissed when it was being used to make up for the former. Not sure what’s so hard to understand about this! if Raavan does nothing in India and a fair bit overseas (though I don’t see this happening either) it will hardly become an overall success! It’s not just about the ‘facts’ but what spin is being put on them. So…
a)MNIK did quite a bit overseas? Yes
b)Because of this the film is an overall success? No
and surely you didn’t miss those ridiculous updates on Bahrain week 6 and Indonesia week 9?!
On Raavan I’d be extremely surprised if the film worked at any level at the box office.
June 19, 2010 at 12:20 PM
Are you not expecting Raavan do fairly well at overseas?
June 19, 2010 at 12:28 PM
Ted, honest answer, I am expecting a Kites sort of performance at best overseas
June 19, 2010 at 12:30 PM
I’m not talking about success, oversees, etc.
Its the tone I’m talking about, satyam.
Then and now.
June 19, 2010 at 12:43 PM
Raavan Review – **
Having liked the combo(Abhi-Mani) not once but twice(Yuva and Guru), the curiosity for Raavan was obvious and it was easily my most awaited movie of the month.
The promotional campaign started little shaky,some of the posters and mannerisms of the Lead were not to my total liking, but eventually the songs picked and things looked fine by the time movie released.
The movie had a Underlying Buzz factor going on for it, as it was going to complete the Troika of Movies between the Director-Actor duo.
For starters, i would not compare the movie much with Ramayan here as even though there are clear references to it, it might call out for an altogether another discussion.
The movie follows the now “in” method of non-linear storyline, which when done well can indeed to wonders.
Movie pretty much starts with the kidnapping of Aishwarya Rai Bachchan(Ragini) by “Beera” Abhishek Bachchan for reasons unknown to us.
Ragini is the wife of town Police Inspector(South Star Vikram).
Sooner than later you start seeing that Beera suffers from some kind of Mental Illness(making weird noises,talking to himself). He takes Ragini to the edge of the cliff over the flowing River and threatens her. In a fit of rage Ragini thinks its better to die herself than being killed by Beera and throws herself off to the River.
Somehow she manages to survive and when Beera goes down to save her, some kind of relationship/friction starts developing between them.
On the other hand, Dev is on the hunt for Beera with his colleagues(with the help “Jungle All Knowing” Sanjeevani, played by Govinda). They go through multiple tricks and plots within the thick jungle in their search of Beera.
Beera and Ragini keep going at each other and some kinds of feelings arise(though hard to decipher), especially when Ragini gets to know the reason for Beera’s Actions(ie Her Husband Dev’s indirect involvement in Beera’s sister’s death).
Rest of the movie deals with how Dev finds Beera, followed by a huge preclimax fight scene on the bridge(Quite well done) and then the extended climax(underwhelming).
There is an intermediate scene between the preclimax and climax , where Dev asks Ragini about her relation with Beera and then goes ahead to ask her to have a polygraphic lie detector test, to justify what she is saying is true(ie she is pure).
Scenes like these seem odd may be because of undercooked Characters. You never get to know the real relation between Dev-Ragini(scenes are less) and also Ragini-Beera track leaves lot to be desired to show some kind of real connect between them.
When the movie ends, there is an lingering feeling that you missed something, even though the Penultimate 20-25 mins has a lot of action going on.(mostly on the right note)
Acting Department:
Abhishek Bachchan : In an Author Backed role, he is the centerpiece in this movie. But unfortunately, somehow this time the connect is missing, the character he is playing is loud and thus needs to be larger than life.His crazy mannerisms remain unexplained throughout the movie(though there was some little inference to maybe he got too affected by his sister’s death). I cant pin down the reason but he just felt “Abhi on Steriods” whenever he went into Beera-mode. Except for the track where his sister gets killed(which infact is the best track probably of the movie, alongwith the Preclimax Brdige fight), i cant say i found his acting Good.
Aishwarya Rai Bachchan: She looked great and for the major part played her role of a stubborn,strong and death fearing/life loving woman to good success. In many scenes she displayed good screen presence. Only in certain scenes,she is not that convincing when she is yelling or crying out for help.
Vikram : Has a Smaller role. Downplays for the most part(vis a vis Beera), is pretty good the Bridge Fight scene.
Govinda : Does ok. Though his intro scene is quite hilarious with him flying and jumping all over the place(defying all laws of gravity).
Visuals : Yes i include the amazing visuals of this movie as one to the characters. The cinematography and the wide scale used by the Director and the team is amazing, and the great thing is all he has used is natural resources – Mountains, cliffs, rivers, waterfalls etc. Its truly a feast for the eyes.
Verdict : The movie is dis-engaging at so many levels, i think it will be hard for most to get engrossed and entertained fully by this Magnum-Opus outing by the duo.
Rating – **
http://boxofficekings.com/?p=388
June 19, 2010 at 12:49 PM
thanks Doga.. your views are always welcome..
June 19, 2010 at 12:46 PM
Fair review, Doga.
June 19, 2010 at 1:36 PM
Raavan Exclusive World Premiere Report
http://www.mymovies.net/player/default.asp?t=Raavan&filmid=10210&ftrid=12795&s=3&n=3
June 19, 2010 at 4:09 PM
below might change more negative or positive tomorrow when i write something… more detail review.. tomo
one of the greatest cinematic experience killed by abhi… for me.. he not bad.. but problem is hes not great.. in a author backed role.. showing his limitations.. hes is just okayish remniscent of may be drona.. in lacking energy… he just doesnt sound beera.. his look havent disappointed ..or the way mani captured.. for me movie was killed by dialogue delievery which was aweful.. he has the presence.. but boy o boy u need to sound beera…
ashwarya rai gives her career defining perfomance for me. i havent like her like i liked her today
BUT hero of this movie is MANI ratnam.. haunting, daring, visually stunning.. .tragedy.. forget ramayan this is entirely different film for me without thinking of epic.
RAAVAN is not an movie but an expierience if only ABHISEKH BACHAN had..
DETAILED VIEWS LATER.
raavan the experience – 4/5 stars
abhisekh bachan – 1/5 stars.
ACTUAL RATING- just watch it for mani ratnam please dont miss it..
its the best movie of the year for me inspite of the fact i didnt like the performance (something similiar to rajneeti where i didnt like ranbir)
if only abhi
June 19, 2010 at 4:30 PM
Agree with Rooney. The movie is undoubtedly different. Its a visual treat, which should be enjoyed on the large screen. However, the lack of a good script lets it down. I am not that bright to get inferences from visual props as compared to old fashioned plot. So for me, it was a very strange experience, but it is definitely an Experience. Not a triviality.
Ash steals the show. Vikram does well in whatever little he has. But Abhi is a letdown. You may blame the script for this underwhelming performance, I feel that he was not consistent and ineffectual in being menacing when he had to, to the point of becoming comical. I wonder what/who inspired him with all that jhik-jhik-jhik stuff. To me, it was akin to a spaghetti performance, great in parts, absolutely mediocre in parts and just falling flat otherwise. The surprise package of this movie is Aishwarya Rai Bachchan. Relax guys, at least one Bachchan shone through this movie.
My 2 cents.
June 19, 2010 at 4:36 PM
Also, that starting 2 minutes with the various cuts/shots was bizarre. I understand non-linearity, but this is ridiculous. When you have set out to make a movie for the masses, why tinker drastically with known formulas for success. Why do all this experimentation and totally rock the boat. Audiences in India have not yet matured to the level to accept all this.
There were many other such instances, and seriously, to a normal daal-bhaat viewer of bwood, it wud seem that something went wrong at the editing table. Woh sochega ki do-chaar rolls mix up ho gaye.
As an example, I will bring in Ghajini. It is supposed to be a ripoff of Memento, but I can bet that had it actually been a frame-to-frame ripoff, it wudve flopped bigtime in India. The makers took the core and applied it beautifully to a standard masala script. I think Mani Ratnam has failed here.
June 19, 2010 at 5:14 PM
Nykavi, but Rathnam’s intentions were clearly different from the GHajini director’s..
I wouldn’t only blame the Indian audience.. many films just fail with many audiences around the world.. filmmakers have lost crores of rupees and millions of dollars too. But they’ve also given us films like Mera Naam Joker and Citizen Kane in the bargain. I cannot truthfully say that I would prefer profitable Himmatwalas (much as I enjoy these films) to Guru Dutt’s Pyaasa!
Of course why is the ‘loss’ element introduced only with such films when most commercial films also flop? The last time I checked Hindi cinema had a success rate of 6-8%! So shouldn’t the lesson be the opposite one? if you have to lose money do so doing something worthwhile that might even stand the test of time!
June 19, 2010 at 7:56 PM
Well, art has no true price, is always a valid argument. And I agree with you about the intent of the one who wants to challenge, or who wants to do something pathbreaking. I dont think anyone is ignoring the loss of major commercial mainstreamers. We have plenty of litered debris of such ventures over the history of cinema. Avatar too was pathbreaking, but it just about managed to keep audience interest intact to rake it in. Ravan tries to straddle both commercial and arty. IMO, that was a gamble which somehow doesnt seem to have paid off.
Commercial mainstreamers spend the moolah to create all the whizbang which can guarantee that the audience is forced to come to a theatre to experience it all. From that aspect, Mani has passed with flying colors. Its the script which is thin.
I think my frustration out here is due to another wasted opportunity. Believe me, I felt the same after D6 as well as JBJ.
June 19, 2010 at 8:12 PM
your set of points here is perfectly fair Nykavi..
June 19, 2010 at 4:43 PM
Exactly my point NyKavi. You do not experiment with 100 cr. If it was a 10 cr movie, heck it would be on it’s way to be a success. I am surprised someone as experienced as Mani Ratnam did not understand it.
June 19, 2010 at 4:51 PM
Kites And Raavan Fetch 18 Crore Combined For Satellite Rights
Saturday 19th June 2010 19.30 IST
Boxofficeindia.Com Trade Network
Reliance Big Pictures had initially sold the satellite rights for Kites and Raavan along with second run rights of some 20 films to Colors for 45 crore but when Kites disappointed at the box office the TV Channel told Reliance Big Pictures it will not be able to pay 45 crore and the deal needs to be renegotiated.
The deal had to come down to 30 crore as Colors were prepared to lose the 2.50 crore advance it had paid to Reliance Big Pictures if the price did not come down.
The second run rights of the 20 films have been sold to NDTV for 12 crore leaving the Kites and Raavan rate at 18 crore for Colors.
This was the situation before the release of Raavan and with Raavan heading towards a worse box office fate than Kites, even the discounted price looks big. The fate of these two big films will make TV channels think twice before making a big money deal prior to release and without knowing a particular film’s fate at the box office. If the original deal had been kept that would have meant a combined price of 33 crore for Kites and Raavan which is more than the combined price of My Name Is Khan and Housefull and both these films are theatrical hits at the Indian box office.
http://boxofficeindia.com/npages.php?page=shownews&articleid=1763&nCat=news
June 19, 2010 at 6:21 PM
hmmm…
its the world of twitters and facebook.. audience reaction and their feedback reaches people even before the film releases..
has happened with 3 idiots, kites and raavan with extreme reactions.. while 3 idiots soared to the skies, opposite happened with the latters..
even if the movie isnt bad in general, people have started to bad mouth anything that they didnt expect ..
maybe without these premiers and pre release previews and reviews flowing in all quarters, the films may not have met the same fate..
(i may be speaking a bit too soon on raavan but still….)
June 19, 2010 at 7:31 PM
you can add raajneeti to that list. the mulltiplex business for raajneeti is unexpected, and one has to believe twitter/fb/sms/online reviews have contributed to it substantially.
June 19, 2010 at 6:30 PM
Pranay,
Thats a risk one has to take.
In India as well as in Hollywood people have tried releasing movies without special previews or leaking out anything prior to release without success. It is taken as a sign of lack of confidence in the product. OTOH, Ipersonally believe that instantly available and shareable info does not really have that much impct. Liked films s till succeed and unliked ones bomb. Piracy on the other hand has had a far greater impact.
June 19, 2010 at 7:33 PM
Rajen .. Kites actually could have done some more first weekend business has WOM not spread so quickly due to the previews
June 19, 2010 at 8:17 PM
Is it not rue for raavan?
June 19, 2010 at 7:57 PM
I believe that to some extent these things do influence.
It is a classic case of BHED CHAAL.
I remember 3I days. There seemed to be this one upmanship in how many times one has seen it. So if one said 5 there was another one saying 8 and so on. There seemed to be a kind of competition.
On the other hand when a film is bad mouthed a lot of people do stay away. Those who brave it usually come back saying ‘huh, it wasn’t as bad as everyone said.’
I think kites really would have done a bit more.
Raavan would have had a better opening.
There was everything going for it. The music was popular, the previews were quite impressive, so I feel the only thing that kept a substantial number away was the viscious way in which views were expressed on Thursday itself.
And Raavan isn’t the only one, I must add.
June 19, 2010 at 8:10 PM
isn’t it all apparent, if a big movie has bad WOM, it flops instantly (Kites, Raavan, Veer)
if a big movie has good WOM, it becomes an unprecedented Blockbuster (3 idiots, Raajneeti)
if it is mixed, it ends up in the middle like MNIK, Housefull
This is because WOM is travelling quicker (twitter/fb/blogs/tv/sms) now as compared to the 90s.
June 19, 2010 at 8:30 PM
Will Raavan recover its investment?
Mani Ratnam’s modern-day Ramayana, toplining Abhishek Bachchan, Aishwarya Rai Bachchan, Vikram and Govinda, opened yesterday. And the buzz is that it won’t be easy for the Hindi-Tamil bi-lingual (with a dubbed Telugu version too) to recover its Rs 100 crore-plus investment (excluding prints and publicity).
Trade analyst Taran Adarsh admits that “the opening isn’t good” but says it’s too early to write it off. “A clearer picture will emerge after the initial curiosity wears off,” he says. Another trade analyst, Komal Nahta, attributes the slow start to the promos that didn’t convey much. “Today, the audience wants to know what the movie is about before they buy a ticket,” he says. “Besides, the film has turned the Ramayana around in the end and Indians don’t like mythology being tampered with.”
Industry veteran Amod Mehra shares the sentiment: “The Friday morning show had barely 20 per cent occupancy. One can’t imagine this from the director of Roja, Bombay, Yuva and Guru.”
Other arguments against the film are that the story is supposedly set in Madhya Pradesh, yet cops are seen wearing Uttar Pradesh police badges, someone is reading a local Jhansi newspaper, some things are typically Maharashtrian, the boats are from Kerala and a cap from China.
Stands a chance
Despite the negative reports, Devang Sampat, vice president, Cinemax, is hopeful of the film picking up during the weekend. “The afternoon show on Friday was about 50 per cent full. There’s Abhishek and Aishwarya Bachchan, South star Vikram, and it’s a Mani Ratnam film,” he says, but believes that the Tamil version will generate better collections because down south, people have a different perception of Raavan.
Nahta too feels that the Tamil Raavan, featuring Vikram as Beera, will do better because he’s a huge star there. Mani Ratnam too has a huge fan following. He signs off saying, “I don’t see the Hindi Raavan succeeding at the box-office.”
June 19, 2010 at 10:12 PM
Trade analyst Taran Adarsh admits that “the opening isn’t good” but says it’s too early to write it off.
—> Taran and Masand should be ashamed to give 1.5 stars for this type of movie.
June 19, 2010 at 10:30 PM
ab itne saalon ke baad ye log kya sharam seekhenge…
June 22, 2010 at 1:51 AM
q,
Absolutely..I have come to that conclusion after reading some of the reviews of Raavan over here in this blog….
June 19, 2010 at 10:42 PM
“Taran and Masand should be ashamed to give 1.5 stars for this type of movie.”
Wow. Why? Do they not have freedom of speech? They cannot express their views or opinions, especially since they are firmly in the majority. I never expected this much biased opinions from this site.
For your reading pleasures, another one star rating.
http://www.glamsham.com/movies/reviews/19-raavan-movie-review-061001.asp
June 19, 2010 at 10:53 PM
Are you Taran? I knew he attacks web sites ..
It looks no use answer to your silly question. Why thsi site is also getting virus affected these days?
June 19, 2010 at 11:27 PM
because of ppl like you that this site is affected by virus
June 22, 2010 at 1:49 AM
LOL..whoever gives bad reviews to Raavan are now bad people…?? what logic is this??
The bottomline is the audince have rejected it big time…Tiny number of pseudo intellectuals doesnt matter at the end…..Even they are liking the movie for the sake of liking…
June 19, 2010 at 9:57 PM
Nahta too feels that the Tamil Raavan, featuring Vikram as Beera, will do better because he’s a huge star there.
- What’s this comment?
I’ve heard South version is better due to better dialogues, better connectivity between scenes and Vikram’s acting. We have to see whether Vikram’s characterization is different from Hindi one
June 19, 2010 at 10:02 PM
Another thing I’ve noticed in Theatre was, most people are from South(AP). I’ve hardly found any north Indian. Tamil one is playing at the same time, not found any Tamilians either.
June 20, 2010 at 12:55 AM
Raavan does 190 K(Estimate) on friday USA.
Its lower than Raajniti 220 K(Estimate).
http://www.moviecitynews.com/weekend.html
Screens 119(Raavan) vs 124(Raajniti).
June 20, 2010 at 1:18 AM
That is little below Expectations, but we can say the people(and there are substantial) who are Ash fans and prefer Tamil, so there could be Audience Division there.
June 20, 2010 at 2:33 PM
551K in the US for the weekend;
http://boxofficemojo.com/movies/?id=raavan.htm
June 20, 2010 at 5:02 PM
this is really bad…..551k over 119 screens? pathetic.
June 20, 2010 at 3:27 PM
besides Roja, all Mani Ratnam movies are style over substance. In Roja, he managed to invoke patriotic feelings. In Anjali, feelings for a family. Unfortunately, he’s gone downhill since.
Mani’s movies are like watching a 2.5 – 3 hr MTV music video. All style, but you don’t emotionally connect.
June 20, 2010 at 4:47 PM
excuse me for saying this but that’s an appalling view.. it’s like saying a great poet doesn’t know how to write because he cannot connect and sell enough books!
June 20, 2010 at 6:14 PM
But it would be perfectly accurate to say that the “great poet” does not know how to write to appeal to the general public.
That is the flaw I find with this argument. What makes a creative work or its creator “great”? Now for instance, I can recall instantly the words and music to certain advertisements from my childhood, both in India and North America. I don’t consider these jingles as “great art” in the same class as, say, a Subbulakshmi concert, but then I have to acknowledge that they had something noteworthy about them to be remembered And it’s not simply that my brain was much less cluttered in childhood, so I can better recall events from those days, because in that case, why don’t i remember *all* of the advertising jingles from that period? The answer is that they succeeded in what they set out to do, namely, to make themselves remembered in the consumer’s mind, while Subbulakshmi succeeded in what she set out to do. The person who finds Subbulakshmi’s singing to be caterwauling and prefers filmi music can be said not to have the training to appreciate classical music, but you cannot dismiss that person’s musical tastes for that reason. In fact, the greatness of people like Subbulakshmi lies precisely in the fact that even people without the requisite background and training can appreciate her music.
And conversely, being unappreciated by the masses is not in itself proof of being too great for their understanding. There are a lot of bad classical musicians around!
June 20, 2010 at 6:38 PM
SM, you’ve answered your own question! How many great poets were expected to produce bestsellers! Your Subbulakshmi analogy is fairly inaccurate. That’s like comparing a Beethoven performance at Lincoln Ctr to the number of albums Guns ‘n Roses sell! It is already a rarefied audience that approaches this kind of work. And for those who do impressionistically they go in with the right ‘mental’ attitude. There are certain films that play in arthouse theaters and get a certain kind of reception even when they’re not liked. You’ve already limited the set! Ravi Shankar is a giant of Indian classic music BUT he is not expected to outsell Laxmikant-Pyarelal!
But even within ‘art’, even within that rarefied world some artists are a lot more accessible than others. More people can read Dickens than James Joyce. Does this mean there’s a problem with the latter?! Just because Dickens is more accessible than Joyce does not automatically make him greater and no critic would argue this. Most of 19th century Western verse was accessible to the informed (thought not expert) reader the way 20th century verse isn’t. No one thinks this itself is a problem with the latter! We can’t instantly appreciate Picasso the way we might a certain sort of landscape painter. What does this mean?
And I honestly don’t see what the objection here is. Are we saying that those trained in a field have opinions only as valid as those who are not! So my opinion on film music should count every bit as much as S Janaki’s?
Now perhaps a Rathnam movie shouldn’t be sold as a regular commercial release. That’s a different argument.
If you don’t like a certain modernist writer that’s fine. But if you then start suggesting he or she doesn’t know how to write some challenges would be in order!
June 20, 2010 at 6:45 PM
Incidentally I know I come off as arrogant or insensitive or at least undiplomatic when I say some of these things. But the greatest arrogance is to be certain about something that one ought not be so certain about. So to use my earlier example I shouldn’t be certain about the distinctions between airbus and Boeing! I am not stopping anyone from having an opinion. This is not a credentials check by any means. But similarly there should be a certain humility on the other side as well.
By the way that earlier age you referred to where Subbulakshmi had TV jingles.. yes I too wish I was part of that age.. much as Hindi cinema once upon a time also bred better audiences.. or at least the dynamics of that age allowed a better space for ‘responsible’ cinema and one which could flourish at times much more than regular entertainment. But we are not in such an age in Hindi cinema and its viewers. Now Tamil cinema would be a different matter. If Raavanan were rejected in Tamil (looks like it might be a success there) I would never make the same charge because there a lot else in ‘new’ Tamil cinema has succeeded. And other stuff as well from Bala to Kamal.
June 20, 2010 at 6:54 PM
Satyam: “Now perhaps a Rathnam movie shouldn’t be sold as a regular commercial release. That’s a different argument. ”
Yes, this is exactly the argument that i think Jeevcy and others are engaging in. A film that is sold for 100 crore has different responsibilities than one that is sold for 10 crore. By definition the former has to appeal to a wide section of the audience, and, if it fails to do so, can be rightly called a failure, whatever be its aesthetic merits, and those calling it so need not be denigrated for their artistic insensitivities. That is the only point I have been trying to make in various posts here. When you make a film on commercial terms, you shall be judged on those terms, and they are valid in that context.
The ad jingles I was referring to weren’t by Subbulakshmi! I know she acted in films (Hindi ones, too — Meera, I believe), but I don’t know if she ever sang ad jingles. When I referred to her being appreciated by even the untrained and untutored, I was referring to things like her UN concert.
June 20, 2010 at 9:26 PM
SM, I’ve already addressed this point in past days. By that token Citizen Kane and Vertigo and Kaagaz Ke Phool and Mera Naam Joker and the Searchers and tons and tons of films that have since been considered canonical or touchstone films also did not fulfill their responsibilties!
June 20, 2010 at 11:06 PM
Pretty sure Hitchcock, Welles, Guru Dutt and Raj Kapoor turned in their graves on the comparison of their masterpieces to a contemporary dud.
June 20, 2010 at 11:11 PM
Actually before they went to their graves there were those dug up for them by the journalists of their age when they made those films and had there been blogs at that time folks like yourself would have been saying pretty much the same thing. 50 years later it’s easy to claim the opposite when history has spoken. Guru Dutt wasn’t driven to suicide just like that! Raj Kapoor never recovered from the MNJ failure. In each case things would have been easier if the media had helped them out. But of course it didn’t because it couldn’t. It didn’t have the tools to do so. It wasn’t just about the box office. Similarly with Raavan no one has to like the film but what’s the hysteria for?
Of course as I ALWAYS say Abhishek is supposedly minor till a big film of his fails and then it’s a TITANIC failure! It’s only a major event when he flops!
June 20, 2010 at 11:12 PM
You know Satyam, once the movie reaches that cult status (which I know it will never), you can bloat about it here on SS. I will come over and congratulate you over here. Celebrating it now is premature when most reviews/audience reaction are negative.
It is similar to SRK fans claiming MNIK will cross 100 cr overseas in the 47th release overseas.
June 20, 2010 at 11:29 PM
Jeevcy, I’ve never depended on democratic majorities for my opinions and won’t here. You’re wasting your time. I think highly of the film. I’ve never insisted that others do also. That’s it!
June 20, 2010 at 5:05 PM
I wouldn’t go this far….I thought Bombay really connected well on the emotional level. I almost had tears in my eyes towards the end.
June 20, 2010 at 11:01 PM
For the many fans of Mani Ratnam’s sublime cinema, myself included, Raavan will be a disappointment. Mani sir takes the universal tale of the Ramayana, familiar to everyone in yearly Ram Leelas, and re tells it in a boring, trivial manner.
Sure, Raavan has unexplored natural locations and is stunningly shot, with misty ravines, raging waterfalls and deep gorges filling the screen, but the narrative is poor, the dialogues clunky, the screenplay repetitive, all of which makes the film a tedious experience. Abhishek Bachchan plays Beera , a renegade outlaw somewhere in deeply forested Laal Matti, and is a mix between a Naxalite, Veerapan and Robin Hood. Supported by his two brothers Mangal (Ravi Kishen) and Haria (Ajay Gehi), he leads some brigands through jungles, killing cops, raiding police camps while looking after poor tribal villagers. We are told Beera is a legend. It doesn’t show.
A new tough cop, Dev (Vikram) is sent to ‘deal’ with him, except Beera kidnaps his beautiful wife, Ragini (Aishwarya), in a stunning scene where he crashes his large boat into her tiny canoe, shattering it. Vikram starts chasing Beera with forest guard Govinda, who finds hidden trails and jumps across trees, monkey like.
Vikram and his cops chase the elusive gang, who stay nearby. Abhishek almost kills Aishwarya except that she jumps off a cliff, while the brigands raid the cops’ camp. Aishwarya tries to escape but is caught, an assistant cop (Nikhil Dwivedi) is captured and tortured and Aishwarya tries escaping again. Damn. All this while, the chemistry between Abhishek and Aishwarya remains strained and confused, like the film.
Finally, Govinda finds Aishwarya but gets captured himself. In a truce, Gehi goes to meet Vikram who kills him. Yup, the plot has pointers from the Ramayana, except they don’t add up. Eventually you learn that Abhishek is on a vengeance because Vikram raided his sister’s (Priyamani) wedding. The police caught her and raped her till she committed suicide. The eventual resolution, when Vikram faces up to Beera over a precarious bridge is a bit stretched. And Vikram asking Aishwarya to take a polygraph test to prove her purity is truly corny.
Finally, Raavan fails in its principal casting, as Abhishek cannot pull off the menace that his character requires. He tries to goggle his eyes, beat his head like a tabla and mutter gibberish ‘chak chak chak’ in an attempt to signify deranged evil but fails as his city demeanor gives him away. One can almost see him on his I-phone after finishing a shot, saying ‘yo dude, whats up’.
Worse, though his face stays muddy, his teeth stay sparkling white: highly unlikely for a brigand outlaw in the forest. Aishwarya stays dirty through the film, screaming her way as she tries to escape, while Vikram is impressive, but with little scope for histrionics. Both Priyamani and Ravi Kishen are good in their brief roles, but it’s Govinda who steals the film in his sharp cameo. AR Rahman’s music is average by his standards and in the end so is Raavan.
Abhishek cannot pull off the menace that his character requires
Rating – 1/5
http://www.mumbaimirror.com/index.aspx?Page=article§name=Entertainment%20-%20Bollywood§id=30&contentid=2010061920100619043259391f694aa48
June 21, 2010 at 1:31 AM
I have to now bear with other’s flops also” – Ramu after the release of Raavan
By Joginder Tuteja, June 21, 2010 – 09:58 IST
Ram Gopal Varma Trust Ram Gopal Varma to allow a joke on himself time and again. He was the last man standing and came up with a big laugh even as his Aag was a butt of jokes for months at stretch. The jokes ended after a while but he never stopped laughing. So much so that in every major conversation with them, the topic of Aag invariably comes up and Ramu too doesn’t mind giving a byte or two on the making and the subsequent destruction of Aag.
No wonder, due to the very fact that he was laughing on his own work (Aag, Shiva – the new one – and some more films) meant that detractors had to find a new way to hit back on the filmmaker who doesn’t mind taking a dig on films by other people as well. While his sweet and sour war of words with Karan Johar comes with an ability of creating front page headlines till date, Ramu truly believes that ever since Aag, he has found himself in a position where he has to bear with other flops as well. Reason being that every time a film flops, it finds a reference to Aag by getting titled as ‘XYZ director ki Aag’.
Says Ramu with mock laughter, “When Tashan came, they said its ‘Aditya Chopra ki Aag’. For Chandni Chowk to China, it was Nikhil Advani ki Aag’. For Kites it was ‘Rakesh Roshan ki Aag’. Now Raavan is being termed as ‘Mani Ratnam ki Aag’. I guess apart from bearing with my own flops, I have to now bear with flops coming from others as well.”
While he is busy with bringing his epic film Rakta Charitra (arriving in two parts) closer to completion mark, Ramu is keeping himself abreast with what’s happening in the world of Bollywood. Also, he is allowing himself a chuckle or two with some of the famed films failing left, right and centre. No wonder, he doesn’t quite mind when reference to Aag comes in every few months.
“I have realized that Aag has now become more popular than Sholay”, he dares to make a bold statement, though with a reason, “That’s because a hit like Sholay comes once in a lifetime whereas a flop like Aag comes every few months. That’s the reason why there are so many references to Aag made time and again.”
Not to be bogged down by scathing comments that are usually reserved for him, he makes a final strike by stating, “I am happy that if not anything else, I at least managed to set up a bench mark for flops. I can see that Aag will live on for many more years to come.”
http://www.bollywoodhungama.com/features/2010/06/21/6367/
June 21, 2010 at 7:29 AM
ravaan was a ok movie abhi and ash was superb vikram did a good job govinda was not bad . it was a bit slow in the first half but by the second half it was faster. all in all the first day collection of raavaan in three languages were around 20-21crore .if it carry on by the first three days it will gross around 33-36crore. i hope it will gross around 51-52crores in the weekend mnik grossed 90.2crore in the first three days and raajneeti grossed around 30-32crore hope raavaan will be a hit. it has two weeks before i hate luv storys hit the screens raavaan has a great chance.
June 21, 2010 at 8:10 AM
i hate luv storys will gross 31-35crores in the first three days and in the weekend it will gross around 55-60crores and overall it will gross around 80-90crores it will be a superhit
June 21, 2010 at 9:49 AM
Raavan Has 17 Crore Weekend
Monday 21st June 2010 14.30 IST
Boxofficeindia.Com Trade Network
Raavan failed to make any headway over the weekend at the box office after a poor start on Friday. The collections remained similar for the three days. Friday business was around 5.75 crore, Saturday was 5.25 crore nett and Sunday was 6 crore nett.
The film was poor in most circuits but single screens dominated circuits were very dull. CP Berar CI and Rajasthan are likely to stay below 1 crore for the whole week which is very bad for a major release. Mumbai grossed around 6.25 crore nett , Delhi/UP was 3.75 crore nett and East Punjab was 1.75 crore nett for the weekend.
The film is likely to show a big drop over the weekdays and the first week business is likely to finish at around the 23-24 crore nett range. The Tamil (Raavanan) and Telugu (Villian) versions did better comparatively as they grossed around 12 crore combined (8cr Raavanan, 4cr Villian) over the weekend but even their good business was limited to the bigger centres.
June 21, 2010 at 10:03 AM
really bummed over how the film has been received critically and at the boc office. I didn’t believe it would be this bad.
Its made even worse because I liked the film. Sure there are things I wish Mani had done differently but to see films like MNIK ore even Kites by some critics be received better critically, well that really bothers me.
June 21, 2010 at 11:46 AM
http://koimoi.c2w.com/2010/06/14/you-asked-it-raavan-hrithik-sequels/
http://koimoi.c2w.com/2010/06/21/you-asked-it-how-much-did-raavan-cost/
Nahata’s price estimates seem like BP oil projections.. changing on a daily basis! I expect it will be a 150 crore project by the end of the week.
June 21, 2010 at 3:58 PM
Box Office: Raavan’s opening weekend low; Raajneeti stays put
HETAL ADESARA 21 June , 2010
MUMBAI: The opening weekend box office numbers of Mani Ratnam’s Ravaan (Hindi) are in. The movie, which had a lot of expectations riding on it, had fetched Rs 170 million (Rs 17 crore) in the first three days of release in India.
The movie’s regional counterparts – Raavanan (Tamil) and Villain (Telugu) have collectively done Rs 120 million (Rs 12 crore) in the first three days.
As was earlier reported by Businessofcinema.com, on its opening day, Raavan’s net collections were Rs 60 million (Rs 6 crore), whereas that of its Tamil and Telugu versions combined were Rs 46 million (Rs 4.60 crore).
Prakash Jha’s Raajneeti in its third weekend is still going strong and done net business of Rs 45 million (Rs 4.50 crore) this past weekend in India. The movie has so far done a net business of Rs 815 million (Rs 81.50 crore) in 17 days.
This makes it the fourth highest collections of a movie in India so far after 3 Idiots (Rs 2.02 billion), Ghajini (Rs 1.15 billion) and Rab Ne Bana Di Jodi (Rs 850 million). Tied at the fifth spot for net box office collections are Dhoom 2 and Om Shanti Om at Rs 800 million.
TOP 5 FILMS’ NET COLLECTIONS
1) 3 IDIOTS – Rs 2.02 billion (Rs 202 crore)
2) GHAJINI – Rs 1.15 billion (Rs 115 crore)
3) RAB NE BANA DI JODI – Rs 850 million (Rs 85 crore)
4) RAAJNEETI – Rs 815 million (Rs 81.50 crore)
5) DHOOM 2 – Rs 800 million (Rs 80 crore)
5) OM SHANTI OM – Rs 800 million (Rs 80 crore)
June 21, 2010 at 4:01 PM
Rajneeti should be able to do 90 crores at the very least.. quite an astounding number for this film!
June 21, 2010 at 3:59 PM
Raavan in US: Good reviews, poor box office performance
June 21, 2010 11:14 IST
Raavan, which got fairly decent reviews in The New York Times and Los Angeles Times, opened to a disappointing box office in North America.
Distributor Reliance [ Get Quote ] has said it grossed $550,000 in three days. The previous Mani Ratnam film Guru which also paired Abhishek Bachchan [ Images ] and Aiswarya Rai had opened three years ago with a $1 million weekend in America and Canada [ Images ] and went on to earn an impressive $2.4 million in both countries.
If Raavan follows the standard rate of attrition in North America (about 60 percent slum in the second week), it will have a hard time reaching $1 million.
Many viewers in New York and New Jersey cinemas thought that the film was too brutal and at times very dark. A few said they had come to the theatres imagining the film was a modern day take on Ram, Ravan and Sita but were surprised by the twists in the story and that the character played by Vikram had shades of good and bad. They had thought only the character of Ravan would be dark and demonic.
It looks like Raavan will gross about half of what two recent successes have grossed in North America. Raajneeti, a bonafide success and Kites each grossed about $1.6 million in North America, though the latter was deemed a flop because of its huge production cost (estimated to be $20 million).
How Raavan will hold in the next two weeks will be crucial to the film’s final fate.
Meanwhile, it is getting some respect from mainstream publications.The New York Times called the film ‘richly atmospheric.’
It added: ‘Raavan has Bollywood glamour aplenty, with the lovely if occasionally dramatically challenged Aishwarya Rai Bachchan [ Images ].’
But the film’s real star is Mani Ratnam, it asserted, ‘ a talented visual storyteller who directs action crisply and fills the screen with striking images. Artful but not arty, Mr. Ratnam delivers the goods.
A R Rahman’s [ Images ] score is ‘excellent,’ the review added, and singled out ‘an eye-popping climactic battle, between the bad-good Beera and the good-bad Dev, on a teetering suspension bridge. And that, folks, is entertainment.’
LA Times argued that it is Aishwarya who is a scene-stealer in the film. ‘Bollywood superstar Abishek Bachchan has the title role of the romantic adventure epic Raavan, the review asserted, ‘ but the movie belongs to his exquisite real-life wife Aishwarya Rai. A blue-eyed beauty who resembles Myrna Loy…’
It added: ‘Director Mani Ratnam and his colleagues give Bollywood fans full value. Ratnam’s pace is steadfastly brisk, and his film is replete with dizzying camerawork, myriad complications, violent mayhem, broad humour, usual musical interludes, a cliffhanging climactic confrontation and a finish that strikes a note of poignancy.’
If only more desi viewers paid attention to the two reviews…
June 22, 2010 at 1:00 AM
Midweek B.O.: ‘Raavan’ rejected, has below-the-mark weekend, crashes on Monday
http://www.bollywoodhungama.com/trade/top5/index.html
June 22, 2010 at 1:14 AM
“A tiny section of multiplex-going audience has liked the film, while the masses have given it a thumbs down. ”
LOL … Taran has mentioned about Satyam and friends in his BO report
June 22, 2010 at 1:33 AM
Ha! I have to grant you this one Jeevcy. This is indeed a funny line!
June 22, 2010 at 1:36 AM
lol
June 22, 2010 at 1:05 AM
Rooney:
rumours? Dhobi ghaat and TMK same day
does any one knows more , i just heard it dont know anything else.
June 22, 2010 at 1:16 AM
satyam u heard anything on this.. this has come out of blue..
June 22, 2010 at 1:32 AM
what is ‘TMK’ Rooney?
June 22, 2010 at 1:34 AM
tees maar khan.. akshay, farah khan.. katrina kaif.. versus
kiranji, aamir, prateik
June 22, 2010 at 1:36 AM
oh, ok.. don’t know anything about this Rooney.. though Welcome released with TZP and both did well..
June 22, 2010 at 1:59 AM
yup….Welcome, TZP both did well…and akki/aamir r good friends so they won’t have any problem with this….if someone will have problem, it will be Farah khan
because she knows that her pot-puri masala will have serious threat from a quality film like Dhobi Ghaat….all in all, it will be a blast time for media for sure….:-)
June 22, 2010 at 1:39 AM
the news is floating around.. NG.. and doga also has some info on it.. but right now no links or nothing in the open
June 22, 2010 at 1:56 AM
that’s true – it is releasing in Dec’10 – i heard in one of aamir’s interview – can’t locate it now….
BTW, There is a CONFIDENTIAL and CONFIRM news that UTV is going for a MEGA RELEASE for PEEPLI LIVE – and i’ve myself heard this from ……well, m not supposed to disclose this…..so pl. book ur tickets in advance
June 22, 2010 at 1:57 AM
Where everybody knows that MNIK underperformed in India it was not a rejected movie…It did 73 cr which is not bad…How many movies in India have crossed that 70 cr mark…Its overseas performance is spectacular…
Incase of Raavan it is a clear washout in whatver circuits it is released..cant be compared with MNIK’s BO…Raavan has been rejected by audince and critics alike…
June 22, 2010 at 2:11 AM
MNIK(73 cr) plus its Overseas(~ expected 80 cr Gross) is a monumental success vis a vis Kites/Raavan.
That it underperformed vs its costs etc, is different matter.
June 22, 2010 at 2:26 AM
I’m actually encouraged by the successive failures of MNIK, Kites, and Raavan. No, not because I’m some kind of sadist, but because it seems to show that the “mulitplex audience” that is supposedly the crucial component to box office success today, is not so star struck any more, but makes its ticket buying decisions on the quality of the film. If this trend is true, it is a very welcome sign.
June 22, 2010 at 2:29 AM
BTW, does anyone know anything about an upcoming film called “Tere Bin Laden”? From the one promo I saw, it seems to be a spoof. I’m asking because it seems to have slipped under the radar of the kind of folks who made such a fuss about the “Dear Friend Hitler” project.
June 22, 2010 at 2:32 AM
i guess this the trailer madam. and i m looking forward to some fun
June 22, 2010 at 2:35 AM
Rooney has put up the trailer.. check out a post on it..
June 22, 2010 at 2:35 AM
now its available as seperate post .. thnx satyam
June 22, 2010 at 2:41 AM
Raavan takes home Rs 530 million
Indiantelevision.com Team
(Updated at 21 June 2010 10:00 pm)
(21 June 2010 12:00 pm)
MUMBAI: Raavan has taken home Rs 530 million, according to opening weekend box-office figures released by its co-producer Reliance Big Pictures.
The Tamil version fared better than the Telugu one, pocketing Rs 110 million to demonstrate that it is a more popular character in Tamil Nadu than in Andhra Pradesh. The Telugu version garnered Rs 40 million worldwide, says a Reliance Big Pictures executive.
The Hindi make, starring Abhishek Bachchan and wife Aishwarya Rai, mopped up Rs 380 million at the box-office.
Raavan was released simultaneously in three language versions and 2,200 screens worldwide.
Box-office trackers said the film had a mixed response and couldn’t start as strongly as Housefull, Badmaash Company, Kites and Raajneeti.
Avers Fun Cinemas COO Vishal Kapur, “On the day of release, the film did average business. But Saturday onwards, the film started getting a lukewarm reception with the occupancy dwindling and varying between 25 and 30 per cent.”
On the opening day, the film got an occupancy between 50 to 60 per cent in several multiplexes. Industry trackers said the film, however, did poorly in other multiplexes and got occupancy between 20 to 30 per cent.
According to trade analyst Taran Adarsh, Raavan did not fetch the desired opening. “In Mumbai, the occupancy was extremely erratic. While in certain big city plexes, the film opened to a better response, it was much lower in the smaller centre plexes and single-screen theatres,” he says.
Meanwhile, Prakash Jha’s Raajneeti continues to rule and its two-week collections stand at Rs 780 million.
June 22, 2010 at 2:46 AM
^^damn, how do i post images here? this got to be the best raavan review
June 22, 2010 at 2:49 AM
better off just providing the link:
http://www.thevigilidiot.com/2010/06/22/raavan/
June 22, 2010 at 2:54 AM
that site is also permanently linked in the sidebar..
June 23, 2010 at 10:09 AM
Wanted Juggernaut at Single Screens,
http://boxofficekings.com/?p=419
(Repost if Earlier missed)
June 22, 2010 at 3:01 AM
“that site is also permanently linked in the sidebar..”
yeah, but you would not know when a new review is out.
June 22, 2010 at 12:19 PM
BREAKING NEWS: BOI confirms Raavan BIG HIT on Monday. Unbelievable! I never thought BOI will have Raavan and Hit in the same article leave aside the same sentence. All prayers of fans on SS have been answered …
http://boxofficeindia.com/npages.php?page=shownews&articleid=1768&nCat=news
June 22, 2010 at 12:44 PM
SS folks, use the deeper analytical and interpretive skills that you have developed here and used so well for Raavan, and you will be able to conclude BOI is implying Raavan is a BIG HIT !! Do you now see what I see?
June 22, 2010 at 12:53 PM
Some of this is getting tiresome.
A COUPLE OF POSTERS WITH NOTHING CONSTRUCTIVE TO OFFER ARE BOGGING THE SITE DOWN.
Much as you hate moderating//deleting, Satyam this is not serving any purpose.
June 22, 2010 at 1:19 PM
I admit, I am reconsidering very strongly in a couple of instances.. I do dislike intervening in this sort of way (and I should add others have the ability to do this too here.. there are other refs.. who will go unnamed) but it would be a mistake for anyone to think that I will let those ethics become ‘suicidal’ for the blog..
June 22, 2010 at 3:27 PM
Latest Bollywood hits the small screen
June 22, 2010 at 3:59 PM
Raavan weekend numbers in the US are lower than earlier suggested. It was supposed to be 551k but it’s actually 480k. This often happens when the Sun comes in lower than estimated.
June 22, 2010 at 4:01 PM
CBO – June 18 to 25
Tuesday, 22 June , 2010, 10:41
Mani Ratnam’s Raavan in Hindi is a disaster, but he can take heart that Raavanan in Tamil has taken the best ever opening of the year at the CBO.
Mani’s loyal Chennai audiences has given a big thumbs up to Raavanan, which has netted a record Rs 90 lakhs in its opening weekend from 15 screens in the city and is in the number one position.
Singam has fallen to the number two position. At number three is The Karate Kid, a film which is holding on well against all opposition.
In fourth position is Hindi Raavan, which opened in six screens to 94 per cent opening on day one, but fell to 65 per cent subsequently.
In the last position is Irumbu Kottai Murattu Singam, which has made a comeback to the charts as publicity has been boosted by the producers.
http://sify.com/movies/tamil/fullstory.php?id=14946268&cid=13525926
June 22, 2010 at 4:03 PM
a great opening was always expected and other than Rajni no one can match Vikram (or surpass) on his openings. Never mind who else the media proclaims as the top Tamil star! Even Surya usually is behind (going by Sify numbers in each instance.. and they’re hardly the greatest Vikram fans!), Vijay or Ajith are not even in the ballpark most days.
Having said that this Raavanan opening is behind Kandasamy’s 1.07 crores.
June 22, 2010 at 5:56 PM
OK, what’s the next “big” Hindi film that is coming up?
June 22, 2010 at 6:37 PM
July : IHLS,Once Upon a time in Mumbai,Khatta Meetha.
August: Peepli Live,Aisha
Sept : Dabaang,No Problem,Anjaana Anjaani,Rakhta Charitra
June 22, 2010 at 6:46 PM
Thanks, Doga. But are all of these “big” in the sense that MNIK, Kites, and Raavan were? That is, are they considered to be “event” films, or films which will pull the industry out of its economic doldrums? I mean:
- IHLS — Imran, Sonam — not really big stars
- Khatta Meetha — has Akshay Kumar, true, but it seems to be a serious film, so is anyone expecting it to be “big” in a commercial sense? (it might be “important” in raising critical socio-political issues)
- Peepli Live — this is a tricky one. Could be an “important” film because of its subject matter, and might become “big” because Aamir is the producer, though he is not in the film, but is anyone really expecting it to be a blockbuster?
- Aisha – same as IHLSl. Might be a hit, even a big hit, but is anyone looking to it as a savior?
- Dabangg — well, it could be “big” in single screens for sure. But is Salman still considered “big” in an overall box office sense?
- No Problem — could be a big hit, I suppose
- Rakta Charitra — might be a hit, but will it be “big”? I also have my doubts whether it will be a hit, given its strong ties to AP politics.
I don’t know about the other two films you mentioned.
June 22, 2010 at 7:49 PM
Big As in “Big” :
Dec 25th – Tees Maar Khan
and Dhobi Ghaat.(also tentatively on Dec 25th)
Dabaang for sure will be big in Single Screens.
Promo is coming 30th July,
Since Wanted i have been on all Salman Movies FB Groups(sometimes in capacity as Admin too), so i will keep posted.
For Dabaang right now all i can say is that the Action part has shaped up well.
Salman may no longer be “Big” in the overall sense, but then i have always liked Underdogs.
Interiors and SS, yeah he is as big as anyone, but Plexes have not been that great.
Infact i became his fan only after i saw Jaanemann and knowing that it flopped.
In few hours i will be putting an Wanted Special.
June 22, 2010 at 7:52 PM
Good, look forward to your special!
June 22, 2010 at 11:58 PM
Wanted Juggernaut at Single Screens,
http://boxofficekings.com/?p=419
http://www.bollywoodhungama.com/forum/read.php?10,2632455
June 23, 2010 at 12:04 AM
This is for Q Bhai too(yesterday had a discussion with him over the “Value” of Single Screens.
June 23, 2010 at 12:23 AM
Thanks!
June 22, 2010 at 7:46 PM
Been away and busy lately. will be back later. but just a quick post–enjoyed raavan-esp the first half.
infact the first half hour or so was what mani is known for—
the last half hour ws a bit of a let-down (for me)-something personal.
dont feel mani did much wrong (except the last half hour)–the way he is being criticised is a bit excessive..
ash and vikram were v good as expected.
abhishek tried hi bit but did not seem to be in his elements-did not take the bull by the horns…
if i need to sum it up in on sentence–abhishek missed an epic, life-changing opportunity…
Not read much reviews or even comments on this blog–just speaking on personal impression. he actually did not even giving his bet–there was a hint of casualness and even carelessness—totally out of place for an opportunity of this sort. maybe some people may find me a bit harsh, but he was the one who had the MOST on stake here, and he did not perform out of his skin.
and mani–one shot sums it up–the last scene where abhishek gets killed by a barrage of bullets –ash stood a foot away from him but was surprisingly shielded. this would be normal practice in a apoorva lakhiya “action epic” but not in a mani film.
feel sorry for amitabh who is having to defend abhishek and then defend his comments on manis editing.
agree with satyam that the editing would not have a decisive impact on box-office.
now am glad (for abhi) that he already has signed many movies pre-ravan release.
(although i hope it does not happen that way)–i feel it wont be the same for abhishek from now on–he will have to work v hard to avoid the downward spiral he is in for now….
feel he should forget about “cutting edge, prestige, dfferent” at the moment.
the ONLY criteria for choosing films (PROVIDED he gets decent scripts/offers) now needs for sometime now is BOx-OFFICE “safe” projects.
(although amitabh may be rite to some extent about manis editing fiasco in the film) he should not belittle himself by indulging in this sort of jack-in the-box comments on mani–the guy who ressurected his sons career.
June 22, 2010 at 7:55 PM
Alex, why did you find the last half hour a let down? I found that in reading many reviews that most people including myself found the moments on the bridge and the scenes afterwards to be one of the highlights of the film.
June 22, 2010 at 8:32 PM
http://www.behindwoods.com/tamil-movie-news-1/jun-10-04/mani-ratnam-big-b-22-06-10.html
MANI RATNAM ON BIG B’S COMMENTS
June 23, 2010 at 12:44 AM
he says he has two or three stories in mind for his next..
June 22, 2010 at 7:55 PM
on retropect, also may add–the subpar opening on the FIRst had something to do with the promos (primaily song promos only)–failed to enthuse the audiece the same way that the relatively innovative paa trailers
at my end(overseas), 90% of the promos showed thok de kili ONLY.
Saw a nahata tv show on film business, where he claimed that mani had made lot of “money” by selling the movie at a v high price much b4 release. the ones losing money will be reliance big pictures. as per nahata, loss will be at least 30 crores–not sure how he calculated?
June 23, 2010 at 8:14 AM
Raavan doesn’t get an epic opening
22 Jun, 2010 04:00 pm
Reliance BIG Pictures and Madras Talkies extensively released their film Raavan in around 2200 screens worldwide making it the first Indian film to release simultaneously in Hindi Tamil and Telugu versions. The opening was average on Friday and with negative reports the business clearly dropped on Saturday.
As per the figures disclosed by the distributors, the opening day worldwide gross comes to Rs 20 crores and the first weekend worldwide gross collection is Rs 53 crores. But one has to take into consideration that this is the revenue generated from all the three versions of the film put together – Hindi ( Raavan ), Tamil ( Raavanan ) and Telugu ( Villain ).
The film worked primarily in multiplexes in metros but the business was poor in single screens and interiors. The negative word of mouth affected the film adversely in a massive way. Mani Ratnam faced a similar backlash when his film Yuva was released in 2004. The film opened to negative reviews and fared badly at the box office though it subsequently acquired cult status.
Sadly, prospects don’t seem to be any good for Raavan as the business that the film did is much lower to that of other recently released biggies. So though the film has no big opposition in its second week with considerably smaller releases in the form of Krantiveer – The Revolution (sequel to Nana Patelar’s 1994 hit Krantiveer ) and Mr Singh and Mrs Mehta (Aruna Shields – Prashant Narayanan), Raavan doesn’t seems to have any scope at the box office.
http://movies.indiatimes.com/articleshow/msid-6078717,flstry-1.cms
June 23, 2010 at 10:02 AM
Raajneeti Continues To Do Well
Wednesday 23rd June 2010 15.30 IST
Boxofficeindia.Com Trade Network
Raaajneeti continues to do well at the box office all over. The heavy fall for Raavan means that Raajneeti is doing rock steady business in the weekdays.
Raajneeti collected 97 lakhs nett on its third Friday and collections on its third Monday were 82 lakhs nett . A fall of just 15%. The business on Tuesday was 70 lakhs nett.
The business of Raajneeti after 19 days is 83.50 crore nett approx and the by the end of its third week it will be around the 85 crore nett mark. The film will have steady business in its fourth week as there is not much competition.
Raajneeti is looking to finish its nett business in the 90-92 crore region making it the third biggest nett grosser after Three Idiots and Ghajini.
http://www.boxofficeindia.com/npages.php?page=shownews&articleid=1769&nCat=news