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474 Responses to “‘Barkhagate’!”
The Barkha Dutt/Vir Sanghi controversy
The story of the pimps and the prostitutes.
Thanks for starting this thread, Satyam. I appreciate the effort it took.
I read this column and the comments. The comments are much more illuminating. When I read through the first 800 or so, they were about 95% against him, and asking him to retire from journalism forever more.
Karan Thapar on controversy..He totally ignores where Sanghvi said he will mould his counterpoint article to certain specific way
Thanks Aarohi, this is indeed a great article- and I would love Mr. Shourie to respond to the following and to give his take on the entire thing:-
re.-Mr. Singh accuses BJP leader Arun Shourie of being on Anil Ambani’s side and reveals how he has managed to get Mr. Shourie replaced as the BJP’s lead speaker by Venkaiah Naidu. How well does Mukesh know Venkaiah, asks Mr. Singh, who is a Rajya Sabha MP from Bihar on a Janata Dal (United) – JD(U) ticket. Ms Radia replies that a senior RIL executive, P.M.S. Prasad, knows Mr. Naidu well. “Then I am going to get him flown in today to talk to Venkaiah,” Mr. Singh says, “because if he is the first speaker, and he already takes a party line, then it will be very difficult for Shourie in his second intervention, to take a different line.
“Of all the three though, Prabhu Chawla’s conversations with Niira come closest to exposing some of what ails Indian media. Niira calls Chawla for some “perspective” in the aftermath of the Bombay High Court judgement on the Ambani brothers’ gas-sharing dispute. They talk casually and knowingly about how the court judgement has been “fixed” and what Mukesh Ambani must now do to reverse the judgement in the Supreme Court. There is no stringing of source here: Chawla openly admits that he wanted to get in touch with Mukesh Ambani to “forewarn” him about the impending judgement and to advise him on what people and routes he should use to swing things in his favour in the Supreme Court. No claim of loose talk or misrepresentation, therefore, can take the compromising sting out of this conversation. Going by this phone tap, there is very little to distinguish Chawla from Niira.”
Even this “stringing along of sources” as part of “normal journalistic process” defense amounts to lying to people to get them to trust you and give information in confidence, which you will then proceed to expose to the whole world — in other words, lying and cheating, which don’t constitute “ethical journalism” to me.
Prabhu Chawla says that he did not say “forewarn him” instead he had said “Probe on him” !!!
Tata talks about Nira’s black gown, Suhel calls Anil snake, Barkha never sounds inquisitive with her talk with Nira and sounds and acts like her PR , Prubhu sounds cheap as he always sounds, Mukesh owns the country, Vir confirms his dalal status and India keep shining.
LOL Pradip !!
Pradip, you have summed it up brilliantly.
And to add,
Vast majority of the public remains apathetic. To their own detriment.
The Tehelka and the Hindu writeups are the best ones here..
I can’t really say that inasmuch as this scandal reveals how much politics and the media and the corporate world form part of the very same nexus it is very surprising. I would assume this to be the case even barring this scandal. But the problem is a systemic one and I think that in the debates over these issues we often miss the forest for the trees. It might be about Sanghvi and Barkha Dutt, it might even be about the ‘plight’ of Indian journalism but the much larger point here is the extent to which ‘compromise’ is built into the very heart of a system that relies increasingly on a corporate framework. Not just in India. We see the very same elements in the US. To paraphrase Badiou ‘politics’ is grafted onto a certain corporate logic.
We all pretend to be very shocked when these things happen but we never protest at the ‘inception’. In other words what does it mean when major corporations either run news outlets or have strong business interests in them or linked to them? What does it mean when corporations invest enormous amounts of money in political careers and so forth? The questions could be multiplied but we never question these basic arrangements. In many ways pouncing on these journalists satisfies our partisan instincts greatly (depending on whether we are on the left or the right) or else we just call it an entirely corrupt game where everyone is so to speak naked. But we neglect to think about that overall system we are otherwise invested in and find hard to critique at so many other levels. Whatever our motivations might be, consciously or not, perhaps focusing on personalities (politicians, journalists..) allows us to avoid the more important questions. Which does not mean that this sort of scandal does not deserve scrutiny. But if one started listing all such political or media or corporate scandals or whatever just over the last 25 years one would have a long list. We see in the film idea just how deep the compromise and corruption runs. The stakes there are far lower than in this present example. One should certainly call out the Adarshs or the Nahatas of the world or whoever but the essential problem here is the extent to which the film media is really like an organ of the industry at this point. Severing this link and how it might come about should occupy our energies. Because even as Nahata and his cohorts might deserve to be criticized all day long this alone does not address the problem. Similarly Sanghvi and Dutt deserve all the scrutiny and harsh commentary that’s being directed at them. But whether people like Mukesh Ambani should have such influence in politics or the media is surely the larger issue here.
agree overall Satyam, but 1. Corporates responsibilty to their shareholders is to maximize profit.
whereas 2. Media’s responsibility to its readers is to bring out the truth.
but media outlets are corporations too! And even if it is their stated aim to bring truth well all the more reason to have corporations completely out of the media business. Much as if we want politicians to simply be ‘sincere’ about governance we can’t have them beholden to corporations. So unless we are willing to think about redesigning the way these arrangements work in radical fashion we will keep throwing up folks like Sanghvi and Dutt.
as much as I hate Barkha’s politics, IMOit is unfair to club her with Sanghvi and Prabhu Chawala.
Oh you’ve always been soft on Barkha!
I need to -1. find which client to bill the last two hours and 2. start working !!
Manu Joseph’s reply to Barkha (In football lingo, it’s Man-U Vs Barca!)
“Tata has a case to the extent that disclosure of private matters like his distaste for black tie dinners, revealed in his conversations with Niira Radia, is not in the public interest. But his case is weakened because Radia is the publicist of his group, which has substantial interests in telecom. That Radia may have attempted to undermine the democratic process by influencing the choice of telecom minister makes their conversation a public interest matter.”
Q: How do you place 1000 journalists in a hotel?
A: Stuff 998 journalists into 499 rooms. Leave Barkha Dutt & Vir Sanghvi in the ‘lobby’.
ha ha ha
How do you fit six journalists in a Ford Fiesta?
Two in the front, two in the back and Ms.Dutt and Mr. Sanghvi in the ash tray!
Not Ash tray sir jee but Madhur ( Honey) tray !!!LOL!!
Who is getting billed for these? Some unsuspecting client!
you are such a buzz killer, ab remind kara diya tau kaam karna padega !!! LOL
Tho to be fair, these two are not alone. Still, scum.
He is not an admirer.
See this part of the article:
Most people don’t particularly like the woman, not that she cares. I think she is shrill, obnoxious, bloated with self-importance, arrogant and opinionated to a fault but that still gave NDTV no right to set her up for sacrifice in this fashion. That is bad form and unethical.
Yes, that’s the smokescreen. Whoever this person is, he gives her a virtual clean chit otherwise!
And he’s gunning for ALL the panelists. He refers to one of the panelists having a shady past (Padgaonkar? even Swapan Dasgupta takes a dig at him in his column!). Even NDTV and Pranoy Roy! When the sensible question to ask is why did it take NDTV, and by implication, Roy so long?
I think his anger (tho misdirected) is more towards NDTV and Roy rather han support for Dutt. To some degree its closing in of ranks.
have to admit it made for good TV, for a change Barkha was on the defensive……..
She was flustered to the max. Came across blabbering for whatever reason. And the grand finale came when she just said — I will see your accusation card and raise you a gender card — this is a smear campaign guided by strong misogyny.
All her answers appeared rehearsed. Smear campaign, misogyny, error of judgment, innocent mistake, inadvertant error. She kept repeating the same words over and over again.
Bikram is probably mad that non is calling him on any of these shows/circus. LOL
non= no one !!
Swapan Dasgupta, one of the panelists in NDTV’s debate, offers a weak follow up:
An exercise in ritual cleansing post-Nira Radia tapes, which left NDTV Group Editor Barkha Dutt looking rather silly on Tuesday night, was seemingly repeated on television on Wednesday.
Ram was not so careful with the other two – Sanghvi and Barkha. “It is very clear that what they did was completely out of line. Their conduct was appalling. Last night, I saw this pathetic performance put up by Barkha. She was rude, aggressive and had absolutely no remorse. The explanation by Sanghvi is unsatisfactory,” he said.
I am glad Congress pimps are being outed.
I have an issue with Q’s comment tho. Sanghvi has no credibility now and doesnt matter what kind of ‘voice’ he was. If he has no credibility, it doesnt matter what he says. Unfortunately that is a problem with a lot of left leaning or liberal journalists that they end up being instruments of Congress (and rarely inadvertantly or unintentionally).
Barkha Dutt, Sardesai and Sanghvi should all lose their voice and credibility forever. Period.
Barkha Dutt is a slightly different creature as she did call out that idiot Roy on her 36 pages in defence of Naxals. But, her role in the MNIK episode was shameful.
sorry but unaware of MNIK episode?
Rajen: I was referring specifically to the fact that Sanghvi has been one of the few liberal journalists to (e.g.) call Pakistan out on national security etc. issues and to avoid the fuzzy Indo-Pak equivalence bit that so many progressive journalists engage in (often reflexively, not out of any principled commitment IMO — which irritates me more than if it were well-thought out commitment to those views). That is the “voice” I was referring to — in its absence what tends to happen is that only “the right” speaks to these issues and hence fills the void. Hence I feel someone like Sanghvi served a useful purpose (obviously, someone who isn’t in bed with lobbyists etc. would be great, but, as is natural in these situations, the baby gets thrown out with the bathwater. I ain’t crying Sanghvi a river of tears — I’m feeling sad for the health of the media space).
Re: obviously, someone who isn’t in bed with lobbyists etc. would be great,
Thats precisely the problem. He is tainted. I dont want my news and opinions, however much they may coincide with mine to come from such people. And , in this case it is the baby that needs to be thrown out, not the bathwater.
Part 3 has the meat-
Forgetting the larger picture here and just focussing on the ‘tainted’ journalists, Barkha Dutt and Sanghvi will bear the brunt of this expose. Prabhu Chawla will most probably get away with it. Why? Because ironically, it’s the social media which has caught on to the journalists and not the electronic media (which is primarily dominated by hindi news channels; the English news channels make up for viewership onl y in the major metros, I suspect) and because the viewership of English channels and the social networking sites is strongly correlated, Dutt and Sanghvi have a lot to lose. Their reputation is ruined for life. The sad part is, Prabhu Chawla, who speaks to a majority of hindi speaking viewers, will get away because his viewership demographic happens to be isolated from social media. It’s the classic case of the great divide between urban and semi-urban India.
very true !!
It’s also sad because Vir Sanghvi’s “voice” — a kind of “muscular” liberalism that was unapologetic about being liberal while also unapologetic about being “India-first” — was relatively rare. Whatever one thought of him, I often found him to be one of the few who was pretty lucid on national security matters etc., and it will be a loss if that voice is silenced or loses total credibility (I don’t care about Sanghvi per se, but I don’t see other English-language journos make the same points)…
Part 4 – Prabhu is grilled by the Singh from Open Magazine
will have to watch part 5 in the office later !!!!
Very logical observation Saket and thanks for all the links and insightful observations.
This one is fun-
The restive audience wanted more time to question Sardesai but he beat a hasty exit before the meeting ended, citing lack of time and a prior engagement. And as he left, another voice shouted, within earshot of his wife Sagarika Ghose, “Did we just hear the president of the editors guild of India, or the editors’ guilt of India?”
Satyam, do you want to start a separate thread on Wikileaks and the ongoing cyberattacks by Anonymous in support of Wikileaks?
In retaliation to the DDOS attacks on Wikileaks, a group of “hacktivists” is organizing DDOS attacks on Mastercard, Visa, Paypal, etc. Now I just clicked on their twitter account, only to get the message that “the profile you are trying to view has been suspended.” Nice, huh?
Einstein is supposed to have said, “I don’t know what World War III will be fought with, but World Was IV will be fought with sticks and stones.” Of course he was talking about nuclear weapons, and the dangers of getting into a nuclear war. Could he have foreseen that the next world war would be in cyber space?
Whatever one thinks of the leaks themselves, it is undeniable that they have galvanized a population or “ordinary” people into trying to take control of their lives again, or else make a last hurrah against the powers that be.
I did see that news story.. not sure though if enough people are interested in an entire thread on it..
Oh, you don’t need to start a new thread. I think it actually fits in this one quite well, since it’s on the topic of the nexus of government/corporates/media.
sm- enlighten me.., i havent followed it
LOL, Rooney, that’s quite a Herculean task! Have you been following the Wikileaks news stories at all? I need to know what your baseline knowledge is.
nope sorry- not have followed them except headlines here and there.
i read today morning some assange got arrestred for not using u knw what during doing what!
and he gave a signed letter to australian.
Oh, my, that is quite a dismal state of knowledge! OK, then, briefly, the Wikileaks site was using Paypal as a means by which people could send donations online. Also, they could donate using credit cards like Mastercard or Visa. Last week, Paypal terminated all activities with Wikileaks, saying that since the site was doing “illegal activities”, it violated their terms of service. People called for a boycott of Paypal, and noted that at least people could still contribute via Mastercard or Visa. Then this week, first Mastercard, and then Visa also terminated their connection to Wikileaks, so that there was no way for the site to raise funds online; previously (at the end of last week) the Swiss bank in which they had their account also froze that account, saying that Asange is not a resident of Switzerland. So yesterday a group of hackers announced that they would launch the same kind or “distributed denial of service” attacks on the websites of Paypal, Mastercard, Visa, the Swiss bank, and a few other places that have recently dropped Wikileaks. These are the same type of cyberattacks that were conducted on the Wikileaks site last week to force them off of the Amazon and later their domain name site. Today they have actually done it. That is, they have crashed the sites of Mastercard, Visa, and Paypal for a few hours each. The group conducting the attacks calls itself “Anonymous”.
That is the gist. :)
I hope you have at least read what the leaked cables have said about events in India, which have been reported in several Indian newspapers.
BTW, have you seen that movie “Fair Game” about the outing of CIA agent Valerie Plame?
@Rooney, I don’t want to hijack this thread, which I think is very important. But briefly, some of the Wikileaks documents said that the LeT in Pakistan was planning to assassinate Narendra Modi, and also to set up new bases of operations in Tamil Nadu and Kerala.
The whole Wikileaks operation and the response from the U.S. Government has many important and complex legal questions — I would think those would be of interest to you. :)
Incidentally, I want to thank everyone else, particularly Rocky, for posting the links on the Radia tapes affair. I’ve been working my way through them, so haven’t posted anything in response, but I do appreciate all the information that has been posted here.
@sm thnks for info… yup got them.. politics
didnt wanted to hijack there.. but i didnt found reply above !! i know u are very particular.. abt organisation.. one thing that i am learning yet!
This is brilliant! India’s own Wikileaks gets bigger…
Confronted with this tape, Mr. Sanghvi still insists he was just stringing her along, “sweet-talking” a news source. In an interview to TheHindu, he claims the final published column included elements that Ms. Radia was unhappy about, proof that he was not exclusively pandering to her agenda
Advani favours public funding of parties for polls
The veteran politician said the BJP was under the impression that the UPA government was decided by Congress president Sonia Gandhi.
Now we realise that even the Congress president does not form the government. Look at the people who are speaking with such authority, who are deciding who should get what portfolio,’ he said
The lameness of these initiatives (I remember the Bush administration hired some top Madison avenue PR firm to help improve the US’ image) is amazing.
The headline is very misleading. The only peoplethe US reps talked to were British Asians who had a tenuous connection with “Bollywood” — hosting TV/radio shows, and the like.
Barkha Badnaam hui- Shobha de’s take-
The last couple of weeks have been tumultuous for those of us in media, with Barkha Dutt getting the worst of it! To extend the earlier argument – the Radia tapes furore was like a virginity test in which the ‘badnaam’ woman ( Barkha) had to ‘prove’ to the world that she is indeed ‘pure’ and untouched. A tough exam for a seasoned journo to undertake, given that everybody with even half an opinion had already jumped into the fray and pronounced her ‘pregnant’….. err….. guilty. She herself was ready for the agni pariksha, as is evident from the grilling she subjected herself to last week – a grilling by peers, at that. Never mind if the dramatic show yielded nothing of consequence and Barkha’s detractors crowed it was a load of baloney that did not salvage her tattered image. Her frequent references to ‘an error of judgment’ made it worse for her… after all, a person at her level gets there because he or she possesses an invaluable asset – credibility. http://shobhaade.blogspot.com/2010/12/barkha-badnaam-hui.html
Dog eat dog?Bitch bite bitch…??
Apparently, one young commuter turned to the other and asked, “But who is this Barkha Gate?” The other answered confidently, “Oh, she is Bill Gate ki wife.” The first one vigorously shook his head and said, “No yaar… that one’s name is Melinda,” To which the second fellow replied, “That’s the first wife, yaar. Barkha Gate is the new one. http://shobhaade.blogspot.com/2010/12/dog-eat-dogbitch-bite-bitch.html
Keep the good work
Rajdeep Sardesai Open letter to the PM-
Critical to this identification process was the knowledge that this was a prime minister who was personally incorruptible. It was a bit like being transported back to the 1970s Amol Palekar era of cinema, where the honest bank manager in a bush shirt touched a chord with audiences through old fashioned values of simplicity and decency. We warmed to stories of how you still owned a 20-year-old Maruti car, how your family members had been resolutely kept away from the trappings of power, and how your lovely wife Gursharan Kaur still went shopping for vegetables in Khan Market.
BENEFIT OF THE DOUBT
Middle-class desis respect intelligence, success and institutional power. Barkha Dutt is the managing editor of NDTV and Vir Sanghvi used to be the editor and editorial director of the Hindustan Times. The shock of the Niira Radia conversations is not that they prove that Dutt and Sanghvi are corrupt: they don’t. They’re shocking because they show us that journalists of their standing seem to think it’s normal and necessary to abase themselves by pretending to be for hire or volunteering to run covert errands for lobbyists and touts
‘Barkhagate’ is among the top 5 twitter hashtags of 2010!
Not a word from Vinod Dua and or Pronoy Roy on Barkhagate.
Hamam main sab nange hain!!!!!!!!!!
well to much ado about visual or t.v media its actually the print media which is doing a bit of ethical journalism
though highly dubious but it was tehelka( though they to had political affiliation) who in bjp regime gone all out on them similarly the monster 2g was exposed first by weekly new age ( mouthpiece of cpi along with frontline as many speculates )
no wonder the same burqa who got highest honour awards from government even though she hardly had much in her resume to show off is sidelined with part of radia’s tapping )
one wonders the silience of pranoy roy on this ( though he himseld had communist linkage being related to arundhati roy and prakast karat)
Also, Bengalis have traditionally held inordinate power in the Delhi media. As a result, it has always been easier for Bengali cultural figures to become national icons than it has been for other regional artistes. If you have heard of Aparna Sen and Rituparno Ghosh (and wondered why), and encountered many times the opinion that Sourav Ganguly is the best captain India has ever produced, it is to some measure because of the gentle push of influential Bengalis in Delhi’s newsrooms
1.All commentators making nasty barbs about Anna Hazare must suggest workable alternatives & demonstrate how it will eliminate corruption!
2.Lofty sniggering columnists sit in their armchairs and pour scorn on Anna Hazare, yet do nothing themselves to advance cause of democracy
3. Indian Express motivated by a pathological hatred of all NGOs. A snobby condescension towards all “do gooders”out of touch with public
4.Lofty columnists yearning for a “political” solution. But politicians today are mostly tycoons,dynasts who don’t give a hang about midclass
5.This is the time to separate the cynics from the optimists. sure there are problems with Hazare movement but arrogance of pol class too much
vague fuzzy wuzzy liberal arts degrees from even vaguer US univs largely responsible!!
The problem really is structural in many ways. I would say the same for the US in a very different sense. And one could multiply these examples. We often have all these debates on democracy and politics and so on and irrespective of what side one comes down on the basic ‘frame’ of the system is always preserved and assumed to be stable. So for example in the US there are constant debates about how corporate interests have bought the system and there is plain corruption and so on. All of this is true. But one must then re-calibrate one’s expectations of a system where this scenario can emerge. In other words it is not that ‘big money’ keeps perverting the smooth functioning of democratic politics but that the latter always contains this vulnerability. The solution in the US is then to radically overhaul the existing political arrangement. But of course no one wants this!
In India an obsession with corruption is also a way for the bourgeois of being blind to everything else. Not that it isn’t a serious problem or that it doesn’t entail serious consequences. From Nepal to Andhra there is a whole Naxalite/Maoist corridor which seems to be expanding all the time. This too is a serious issue. The question though is: how did this happen? What about the Indian state enables telecom scams worth gazillions or allows huge parts of the state to slip out of political control? So on and so forth. The bureaucratic solution, which is the one being offered in the current situation, is the classic means by which democracies (especially India!) neutralize the more dangerous aspects of protest. so let’s have some ‘oversight’ and everyone’s happy. If there is possibility for abuse in a system that abuse will occur at one or the other nodes of that system. It’s like saying there will be tougher financial regulations for banks. They’ll just work around them in newer ways. What is problematic in each case is precisely the arrangement that allows for that kind of banking with the misguided idea that it’s all about free markets and what not. Similarly in India massive corruption isn’t just about people who haven’t been punished enough but about a system that incentivizes corruption in various political and bureaucratic ways. Actually if there were not corruption the system would be unrecognizable in its current form. So much of the corruption is institutionalized, not even regarded as such.
What needs to be changed is the basic ‘order’ of the state. Just because we have democracy doesn’t mean we cannot have a better democracy. But that ‘better’ one won’t come about with hopeless ‘micro’ solutions that do not at all change the overall functioning of the state apparatus in all its forms. And again the same goes for the US. There is corruption but a great deal of it is of the structural kind.
Every few years and with increasing rapidity now the ‘conscience of the nation’ is shocked by the latest scandal of corruption. with a 24/7 news cycle there is a thriving industry for such scandal. One of the principal sources of bourgeois entertainment! What happens at the end? These outcries are really ways to not change anything at the end. Not least by adopting changes that don’t address the larger problem. As that famous line in the Leopard goes ‘change everything just a little to let everything remain the same’!
Satyam -you simply love to hate the bourgeois class.
I’ll be honest with you , I was not familiar with this word until couple of years back I started reading your essays. I had to look it up in the dictionary. but why so much hate for bourgeois ??? Big B had mentioned that the labor class does not care who will rule the country ( after lal bahadur shastri jee’s death), the rich are not affected, who the ruler is, they have the money power, so basically the so called middle class is the one who gets affeted and for once if they have taken upon themselves to come out and protest then what is the prolem ??
it’s not hate Rocky.. it’s just that it is the dominant class and one has to deal with it.. the other ‘classes’ don’t have comparable power. And one might not agree with me but how many more scandals does one want to get indignant about every single year? Clearly whatever the solutions are supposed to be, they’re either not coming up in the present system or not working when applied? So we can froth and foam at the mouth every single year about the latest corruption scandal but that really doesn’t change anything.
Swapan das Gupta-
It is not that the misgivings over the exaggerated self-righteousness of some of Anna’s chief backers lack any basis. The likes of Swami Agnivesh, Medha Patkar and Prashant Bhushan have often conveyed the impression of being activists in search of causes to latch on to. Their presence doesn’t enhance the quality of any movement, especially not a rooted, middle class stir. However, what is also relevant is the credibility of those levelling charges against the wild, anarchist streak in Anna.
The significance of last week’s excitement over Anna’s fast lies in the formal withdrawal of middle class support from the Congress and Singh. The enthusiasm for a new icon was directly connected with the disappointment with a PM in whom so much faith was reposed. The PM was shown to be a man of straw and the middle classes have rejected him unequivocally. It is striking how little those who backed Anna with an infectious enthusiasm were moved by arguments that the sovereignty of Parliament was being undermined and that India was witnessing the tyranny of the non-elected.
The second paragraph is the sort of thing I’ve been referring to. The middle classes withdraw support and then give it to another. This doesn’t change anything. By the same the system also accounts perfectly for the Anna Hazare sort of figure emerging every some years! This too doesn’t alter anything. At the most a govt comes down and it’s on to the next.
just as the Communists saw ‘fascist forces’ in JP’s movement.
He is neither young nor tech-savvy; he doesn’t talk the ‘development’ jargon of well-travelled NGOs; and his politico-cultural symbolism—Chhatrapati Shivaji, Swami Vivekananda, Mahatma Gandhi, Bharat Mata and Vande Mataram—is seemingly at odds with modernist impulses of India’s aspirational classes. Yet, Anna has become the unlikeliest symbol of a movement that may well end up unseating a government, even if it doesn’t succeed cleansing public life.
it’s not about right or left as far as I’m concerned though one can be co-opted all the same (Anna Hazare by invoking Modi reveals the ‘obscene truth’ I have been talking about.. it’s not that there’s anything wrong in praising Modi’s ‘efficiency’, it is looking at ‘efficiency’ in the absence of every other debate).
and this is an example of the co-optation I’ve been referring to. Not to mention some of the other ‘religious’ elements that have thrown their lot with him.
Very recently, those of us who were not privy to the deal making learnt to our shock that a major interview with A. Raja in defence of the telecom licensing policy published on May 22, 2010—that was referred to by the Prime Minister in his press conference–involved a direct quid pro quo in the form of a full page, colour advertisement from the Telecom Ministry that was specially and hurriedly cleared by the Minister personally for publication on the same day in The Hindu.
Rocky—i have not been following the shady dealings of a raja and the latest on the 2G scam.
But whats of interest to me is the role of the honorable “nice man” Manmohan singh. Do admrie MMS overall but what has been the concensus on the role of MMS ( Was he a passive spectator or not in the know or an active accmplice??)
alex- i wish/hope/pray that he was just a passive spectator….. but then who knows!!
My oh my. N. Ram turned the Hindu into “an apologist for A. Raja” says another senior editor at the paper
Barkha khush toh bahut honge aaj aap. Those who grilled you are left with nowhere to go
Hey all you well meaning jurors out there with the “just say sorry” motto, planning to ask Times Now and the Hindu, to to the same? :-)
I think Manu Joseph must be getting nightmares right now about some leaked letters/CDs/pdf #radia #NRam
indeed I wonder if mr thapar will do a media debate now. Or was that just for “select” people ;)
Times Now would do well to remember: People living in glass houses should not throw stones at others, especially Nira Radia. 1/2
“alex- i wish/hope/pray that he was just a passive spectator….. but then who knows!!”–Thanks Rocky
But y does one have to “wish/hope/pray”!!!
When this scam (among others) has incited a whole mini potential “revolution” (hazare)—and with a hyperactive media, why hasnt the role of MMS and the italian connection (if any) not been investgicated in more detail.
By the now, “who knows” was not the result i was expecting—should have been “laidbare”-lol
I saw her defense. I found her uneducated. She boasts being a wannabe lawyer in her twitter profile. Hope she goes to that profession. We hve banned watching her shows at home. I had not hate towards her but this incident has makes me feel sick after watching her on tv. Such a snob!!!!
Tehelka is possibly more popular in Pakistan than it is in India and why should it not be since its major claim to fame was a sting operation (more entrapment than sting) that put defence purchases by India’s armed forces on hold for more than five years. It routinely promotes the cause of jihadis and Maoists and nearly always has something bad to say about anything that has the word Hindu in it. After I appeared on Nidhi’s show I received a small floodgate of tweets from twitterers who had seen the show asking if I knew where Tehelka got its funding from. I do not and nor do I care to speculate but what I will say is that most of Tehelka’s investigative journalism seems designed to prove that India is as failed a state as Pakistan and that Indian democracy is mostly a sham. It is a viewpoint that is beginning to get on my last nerve.
thats the everything everyone knows … tehelka at times acted as mouthpiece of congress
btw hazare effect … italian godmother has sensed it perfectly and is out of the country so do most of big mouth of ruling elite who has gone into hinding
rocky:kind of scene which i witnessed at pragati maidan is simply mindblowing and good to see most of young professions and educated elites which have come up in big numbers to support this …. this is what movement of ramdev lacked which has the support of r
*which has the support of rural india*
btw tavleen singh never supported anna hazare anyway but ya atleast she never change position …. its kind of funny to see mahesh bhatt and hazare’s movement
he has no problem when his son was doing guest of honour for headley…
April 7, 2011 at 11:12 AM
Hazare is on to something big this time…. I hope it brings some meaningful and much needed changes…”
“Forensic Audio had found four instances of doctoring. Now, McVickar found five instances of manipulation, with “missing words and broken phrasing”. His conclusion was that “within a reasonable degree of certainty” the tape was not original and had probably been ‘manipulated’.”
If there is manipulation, was it on his part? And they downloaded from outlook website. Of course lots of noise could be introduced by how encoding was done or how it was uploaded or downloaded. :)
seems like a nice watch, will watch it later Bliss…
the link is freezing up a lot,
aside- Bliss you should check out the interviews of Sagrika and Bhupen Chaubey at newslaundry…. Madhu asks them the likely impact of Mukesh Ambani ownind IBN now …
actually Interview with Ashutosh is also very interesting there…
Seen all, but the best was Prasoon Bajpai and Karan thapar, Madhu made Puppy out of Karan. Have you seen that one??
Ya , I have seen them both…really nice ..
I am eagerly awaiting Vinod Sharma One( unofficial spokeman of congress) ..The teaser is so Good when he says that he has criticized congress in 1984, in reply to Madhu’s Q of has he ever criticezed congress … Lolzzzzzzzzzz :D
Will you please make a post of the documentary I posted above.. its Must watch for all and should be on front page so that more and more people see it..
Rest I leave it to your wisdom :)
“Rest I leave it to your wisdom :)”
LOL, let me know where you found this [wisdom]!
I’ll look into the documentary.
Aside – even if create a seperate post, please leave the above link here as well, that way we will have a comprehensive reference Post…
Yep … Brilliant doc.. Must Watch
Vinod Sharma ob CYTI,Newslaundary
Comprehensive Piece on Subramanian Swamy ( CARAVAN)
Q-” can u take it kanchan Gupta ?”
Rebound q1-who the heck is kanchan Gupta?
Q2-Take in what? Hoho
Very nice intw ..
BRILLIANT ……. Chitra Subramaniam( Who Broke Bofors Story)
Thanks Bliss, I did see the Chitra on on NL…
did not know who Kanchan Gupta is so ignored it, is it good ? what is about ??
Kanchan gupta is Journalist, now Deuty Editor at pioneer, previously at Telegraph and the statesman and than turned right, left job and joined A.B Vajpayee’s PMO Office…and became what some call ‘bigoted fundamentalist’
phir toh dekhna padega …apney hee paaley ka hai !! LOL
Damn Rocky, even someone like me who hardly follows Indian politics knew about Kanchan Gupta…I thought you were Satyamshot’s go to guy for something related to Indian politics, just like Satyam is the go to guy for everything under the sun. :)
LOL, sorry to disappoint you matrix
Which one Bliss…watched Chitra’s few days ago…..
amma – hamari aur Bliss kee guftagoo mein – Tu Kaun, Main Khamokhaan….LOL
just kidding Di..
sorry…pata nahi tha ki kabab mein haddi hun mai. Aap dono ki beech mai RNBDJ kaa chakker tha aisa hamey malum nahi tha. Theek hai this khap will now disappear ;-)
let the love bloom…
arrey aap khaap naheen, aap toh iss group kee khaala hain
Its seems only We The ’3′ enjoy this thread and are somewhat interested something besides ‘cinema’…
Like irrfan tribe, let this tribe also blooms :)
bas Saubloom sey kam hee ho toh achcha hai …
Jab zyaada samay dushmanu ki khabra lene main busy rahogo toh Mirchi seth ki ‘Asli cheez’ miss ho jaati hain
I knew Right will like the ‘right’ .. LOL!
I know right…….
Aside- did not work for more than 2 hours yesterday out of 8 hours, aaj toh kaam karna hai..
Aside-2 – saw his debate with (old) Shoma at NDTV( link is on his blog)….Shoma kee kah kar ……..
Ek dumb question hai…yeh “kahe kar lunga” kaa matlab kya hota hai (sorry not from puccha hindi belt but I sometimes pretend to be like I turn bangali from time to time ;-)
The most PC way of saying that would be – Kah kar teri Izzat loonga ….
agar kanchan Gupat and Swapan das gupta jaise thode aur bangali sudhar jaayen toh desh ka bhala ho jaaye..
Shoma seth thinks too high of herself and no doubt tehelka is good journal but there are specific questions over its funding… She ahs answer for everything under sun, let us bring her here so that all fans will be happy :)
ha ha …..that would be the day …
It figuratively (in this context) means- “i will screw ur case only after i warn u”- it literally means- ” i will forcefully take ur virginity after telling u”
kahe kar lunga then seems like a taunt…saying “as if” I am gonna tell you/ask for permission before taking it. Like a goonda. Never heard of such expression before. I guess I am from “decent” times. What sattu calls “bourgeosis”.
Thanks folks for clarifying.
Everyone will give both hands to clarify such terms :)
Ha ha..jab koi maang raha hai ( explanation), toh harz kya hai …lol just kidding!!
In the north, these ‘taunts’ r very common. have made some taunts like these myself in certain extreme situations. it’s got nothing to do with any social class or changing order (the manner in which we used it was “wait and watch how i fcuk ur case”)
Not seen yet but than Swamy always surprise, shocks and sometimes offends …
Mathew Samuel, the journalist instrumental in Tehelka’s Operation Westend speaks on sting-operations, how he was hounded by government agencies and why no journalist would want to be involved in a sting after what Tehelka was put through.
The truth is we are born-hypocrites. The middle-class values of Delfjizhlity, Seuqwflkgting and Mdefrihyrtliousness have held this nation on a tightleash for too long, and it is time we discarded them to that dustbin of history where other such unintelligible and nonsensical value-systems are left to ferment to their slow deaths. The nation wants release from that leash
kyon Thak raha hai yeh……kitna cofoosing article hai …….. gaale dene sey aur sunney sey middle class mahaaan ho jayega.. wah bhai wah !!
K Nayar’s book is out… Excerpts are here
Lal Bahadur Shastri
Was he poisoned?
Gen Ayub was genuinely grieved by Shastri’s death. He came to Shastri’s dacha at 4 am and said, looking towards me: “Here is a man of peace who gave his life for amity between India and Pakistan.” Later, Ayub told the Pakistani journalists that Shastri was one person with whom he had hit it off well; “Pakistan and India might have solved their differences had he lived,” he said. Aziz Ahmad, Pakistan’s foreign secretary, rang up Bhutto to inform him about Shastri’s death. Bhutto was half asleep and heard only the word “died”, and apparently asked, “Which of the two bastards?”
When I returned from Tashkent, Lalita Shastri asked me why Shastri’s body had turned blue. I replied: “I am told that when bodies are embalmed, they turn blue.” She then inquired about “certain cuts” on Shastri’s body. I did not know about those because I had not seen the body. Even so, her remark that no post-mortem had been conducted either at Tashkent or Delhi startled me. It was indeed unusual. Apparently, she and others in the family suspected foul play. A few days later, I heard that Lalita Shastri was angry with the two personal assistants who had accompanied Shastri because they had refused to sign a statement which alleged that Shastri did not die a natural death.
Martyred on the front, Brigadier Usman’s story is an ode to honour
No military commander in independent India, except one, has received a state funeral. But so overwhelmed was a nascent nation at the supreme courage and sacrifice of Brigadier Mohammad Usman 66 years ago that Prime Minister Jawaharlal Nehru and his cabinet colleagues turned up at the funeral of the hero—the “highest ranking military commander till date” to lay down his life in the battlefield—who was laid to rest with full state honours on the premises of Jamia Millia Islamia in New Delhi.
Two memorials, one at Jamia Millia Islamia, the other at Naushera, stand as silent reminders of the man today—as the nation prepares to observe his one hundredth birth anniversary.
It was 5.45 pm on July 3, 1948. Jhangar near Naushera (Jammu). The sun was about to set and the brigadier, having offered his evening prayers, was holding the routine, daily meeting with his staff officers at his command post—actually, a makeshift structure rigged with the help of a few tents. A sudden burst of shelling sent them all scurrying for cover behind a rock formation.
The brigadier sized up the situation and saw the enemy’s field guns to be too well-entrenched. Spotting an enemy observation post sited on an elevation, he shouted instructions for his field guns to engage the fortification while he himself attempted a dash, presumably in an effort to alert others. But as he stepped out, a shell from a 25-pounder landed almost next to him—its splinters killing him on the spot. Usman died 12 days short of his 36th birthday.
Hailing from a modest, middle-class family in Azamgarh, Uttar Pradesh, Usman had steel in his spine. At the tender age of 12, they still remember of him, he had jumped into a well to rescue a drowning child. He had a stammering problem in childhood, but overcame the handicap by sheer willpower. One of the ten Indian boys to secure admission to the Royal Military Academy (RMA) at Sandhurst, England, in 1932—the last batch of Indians to do so—the feat made no less remarkable by that distinction. Usman was commissioned in the storied Baluch Regiment at the age of 23 and saw action in Afghanistan and Burma during the World War. He rose quickly to the rank of brigadier, drawing attention to himself by his firm and fair handling of the precarious communal situation at Multan. During the splintering of the army in the wake of Partition, Usman was offered the promise of out-of-turn promotions and the prospect of becoming the army chief in Pakistan. A senior Muslim officer at the time, everyone expected him to grab the offer.
But the brigadier surprised everyone by opting to stick with India. Neither Mohammed Ali Jinnah nor Liaquat Ali Khan could convince him to have a change of heart.
Of Usman’s heroics, former vice-chief of the army staff, Lieutenant General S.K. Sinha, then General Staff Officer to General Cariappa, recalls: “I accompanied General Cariappa to Naushera. He went round the defences and then told Brigadier Usman that Kot overlooked our defences and must be secured. Two days later, Usman mounted a successful attack against that feature. He named it Operation Kipper, the General’s nickname. A week later, over 10,000 infiltrators attacked Naushera. With Kot held by us, our boys inflicted a crushing defeat on the enemy, who retreated leaving over 900 dead. This was the biggest battle of the Kashmir war. Usman became a national hero.”
The defence of Naushera, against overwhelming odds and numbers, made him a living legend. Naushera ka Sher. The Pakistanis announced a prize of Rs 50,000 for his head, an astronomical sum in 1948. But even as congratulatory messages poured in, the brigadier remained unaffected and continued to sleep on a mat laid on the floor. He had taken a vow that he would not use a cot till he recaptured Jhangar, from where he had to withdraw earlier in the face of a fierce onslaught by the infiltrators. Jhangar was of strategic importance, located at the junction of roads coming from Mirpur and Kotli. But more compelling was his fierce pride in his men and determination to restore their honour.
On March 15, 1948, the brigadier signed an order to the “Comrades of 50 (I) Para Brigade”. It read: “Time’s come for the capture of Jhangar. It is not an easy task, but I’ve complete faith in you all to do your best to recapture the lost ground and retrieve the honour of our arms—we must not falter, we must not fail. Forward friends, fearless we go to Jhangar. India expects everyone to do his duty. Jai Hind.” Three days later, his troops recaptured Jhangar.
The legend grew. It would have grown larger still. Had the Lion of Naushera survived the July of 1948, could he have ended his career as India’s first Muslim army chief?
To Cast The First Stone
Sex, violence, corruption, insider exposes rock the Kerala church
“Later, I’m taken to the priest’s room for coffee. While I’m having coffee sitting on the cot, the only place in the room to sit, he comes and embraces me hard, almost suffocating me. When I struggle to escape from his clutches, he squeezes my breasts and asks me to show them to him. ‘Have you seen a man?’ Stunned, I shake my head ‘no’. In no time, he undresses himself.”
Sister Jesme in her book Amen: The Autobiography of a Nun
“The convents and nunneries are being converted into brothels. The priests have sex with the nuns at night in these convents. Because of these acts, the chastity of the priests and nuns has come under suspicion. Their love for God has shrunk…some of the clergy protect their chastity by watching pornography and reading pornographic material. They lose themselves in this habit. These books and DVDs are kept in secret places and can’t be found easily.”
Father Shibu Kalamparambil in his memoir Oru Vaidikante Hrudayamitha (The Heart of a Priest)
“The cry of a baby came from the bathroom of one of the inner rooms along with the sobs of a woman. We used our might to force open the bathroom door and what we saw would break anyone’s heart. A nun who had given birth to a child was pushing the head of the baby into the closet. The bathroom was filled with blood. The legs of the child, which were sticking out of the closet, were kicking for life.”
Sister Mary Chandy in her autobiography Nanma Niranjavale Swasthi (Peace to the One filled with Grace)
abolishing of article 356 will go a long way in helping situation in kashmir and assam but it will hurt vote bank
sorry i mean article 370 ….this is just psuedoi secularism which signifies great danger for india in future
i have seen trimendous resentment among the assamese whenever you interact with them and this is happening for a decade or so …this was bound to happen and most of these migrants are heavily involved in crime
in subcontinent there is only one country which is secular and that is because of its tolerant majority and if that is disturbed even india won’t be secular
It is a pretty simplistic explanation: but one other interpretation is armed Bodo militants seeking to alter the demography of certain districts to subsequently strengthen demands for a separate state. The Assamese (ethnic group) is not especially relevant to this conflict — except that Bodo militants have been clashing not just with Bengali Muslims but with Assamese ones too. There is simply no basis for presenting this as a “native” versus “illegal migrant” issue, there are a lot more strands and complexities here. [Aside: it's pretty funny that some on the right are now painting the very Bodo groups vilified as secessionist, Christian etc. for years, as the native victims in alleged aggression by illegal migrants.]
and what followed was exemplary when north east people where threated to movie out from other part of the country and threatened as part of backlash
The National Democratic Front of Bodoland, also known as NDFB or the Bodo Security Force, is an extremist outfit which seeks to obtain a sovereign Bodoland for the Bodo people in Assam, India. The founder of the organization, Ransaigra Nabla Daimary, alias Ranjan Daimary has been arrested and detained by Indian authorities. Though NDF advocates sovereignty for Bodos, however, majority of its members are Christians, who themselves do not represent majority indigenous Bodos. Bodos use Devanagari script as medium of writing, but NDFB promotes Latin script to suite their agenda
Basumatary also accused All India United Democratic Front (AIUDF) chief Badaruddin Ajmal for playing communal politics and held him responsible for the ongoing attack on the students and people of the northeast in other states of the country, forcing mass exodus.
Basumatary said that Bodos would not allow Ajmal to enter BTAD areas in future.
He also slammed the Centre and the state government in Assam for being soft towards Bangladeshis and said that Bodos are becoming minority in their own land losing their right over land and resources and the various governments have failed to do anything in this regard.
“This is one of the reasons for which the Bodos have been demanding a separate state for last 44 years,” he said.
ram jeth malani has openly said in parliament about an ex indian prime minister ( who is dead ) on how he was 14th in the name list of people with most black money but did anyone of the congress have the guts to sue him simply because he is allready handling that case and will tear apart the clowns literally
He repeated the same recently again on Black money debate …
This was just such a great great Interview…the guy is a genius…
Arun Shourie coupled with kanchan Gupta are two sane and hard hitting so called “Righ”t people..
Kanchan Gupta’s recent tweets to Burqa Dutt are brilliant !!
He IS Genius …
What tweets ????
Can you paste them here????
the incident where one Maulvi issued a Fatwa where the male Office colleagues were required to suck up on breasts of female office colleauges so that they can” become” thier relatives and then in turn could work together is really disgusting …….
LOL, didn’t know about this. These guys are such sickos!
Dear Teesta, big bucks to be made in Assam. So many B’deshis waiting for you to milk their ‘tragedy’. So many fake affidavits to file…€$£
@BDUTT On a lighter note, if I were to illegally squat on your property, you would allow me partial rights, right?
@BDUTT In other words, when it suits Muslims, bend the law. Or, the law of the land is not meant for them.
Astounding that ‘partial citizenship’ is being proposed to ‘accommodate’ Bangladeshi Muslims. Why restrict? Open to Pakistanis too
Mohandas, Subhas, Jawaharlal, Bhimrao chat about India at 65
The scene is heaven. India’s founding fathers are bored out of their minds by immortality and are longing for the tumult of India. They are all lazing around, all on first-name basis: Mohandas Karamchand Gandhi, Subhas Chandra Bose, Bhimrao Ambedkar, Rabindranath Tagore, Sardar Vallabhbhai Patel, Shyama Prasad Mukherjee, C. Rajagopalachari, Ram Manohar Lohia, E.M.S. Namboodiripad, Hansa Mehta, Madan Mohan Malviya, Chittaranjan Das, Zakir Husain, Jayaprakash Narayan.
Suddenly, Narada shows up to needle them.
Narada: So, dudes, how does it feel? India turns sixty-five. Not bad, eh?
Subhas (with sarcasm):
Ask Mohan. He is the Father of the Nation.
Mohandas: Turns out I am not. The government never issued a notification. In any case, Bhimrao is the new god down there, ask him.
Bhimrao: No thanks to you lot! Ask Jawahar. (Turns to Jawaharlal) How’s your tryst with destiny? Has India awoken to life and freedom?
Jawaharlal: It has certainly awoken to life, the freedom thing is more complicated.
Rajagopalachari (rudely interrupting): Trust Jawaharlal to make freedom complicated. For him, freedom was freedom for the Congress to rule, not freedom for ordinary people to carry out a trade.
The Laws of Manu is one of the most exemplary texts of ideology in the entire history of humanity. The first reason is that while its ideology encompasses the entire universe, inclusive of its mythic origins, it focuses on everyday practices as the immediate materiality of ideology: how (what, where, with whom, when…) we eat, defecate, have sex, walk, enter a building, work, make war, etc. The second reason is that the book stages a radical shift with regard to its starting point (presupposition): the ancient code of Veda. What we find in Veda is the brutal cosmology based on killing and eating: higher things kill and eat/consume lower ones, stronger eat weaker, i.e., life is a zero-sum game where one’s victory is another’s defeat. The “great chain of being” appears here as founded in the “food chain,” the great chain of eating: gods eat mortal humans, humans eat mammals, mammals eat lesser animals who eat plants, plants “eat” water and earth… such is the eternal cycle of being. So why does then Veda claim that at the top of society are not warriors-kings stronger than all other humans, “eating” them all, but the caste of priests? Here, the ideological ingenuity of Veda enters the stage: the function of the priests is to prevent the first, highest, level of cosmic eating: the eating of human mortals by gods. How? By way of performing sacrificial rituals. Gods must be appeased, their hunger for blood must be satisfied, and the trick of the priests is to offer gods a substitute (symbolic) sacrifice: an animal or other prescribed food instead of human life. The sacrifice is needed not for any special favours from gods, but to make it sure that the wheel of life goes on turning. Priests perform a function which concerns the balance of the entire universe: if gods remain hungry, the whole cycle
Thanks Bliss, an interesting read, in the characteristic Zizek style. Another good excerpt:
“British colonial administration of India elevated The Laws of Manu into a privileged text to be used as a reference for establishing the legal code which would render possible the most efficient domination of India – up to a point, one can even say that The Laws of Manu only became the book of the Hindu tradition retroactively, chosen to stand for the tradition by the colonizers among a vast choice (the same as its obscene obverse, “tantra,” which was also systematized into a coherent dark, violent and dangerous cult by the British colonizers) – in all these cases, we are dealing with what Eric Hobsbawm called “invented traditions.” What this also implies is that the persistence of the phenomenon and social practice of the Untouchables is not simply a remainder of tradition: their number grew throughout the nineteenth century, with the spreading of cities which lacked proper canalization, so that the outcasts were needed to deal with dirt and excrements. At a more general level, one should thus reject the idea that globalization threatens local traditions, that it flattens differences: sometimes it threatens them, more often it keeps them alive, or resuscitates them by way of adapting them to new conditions – say, like the British and Spanish re-invented slavery.”
It seems plausible, as Manu is not authority but made so recently may be by British to fuel their own agenda and motives…
But one can’t reason that out as most of us never go back to source and read it .. we believe hearsay’s and what is being repeated to us perennially…
We all know at surface level wat Mahabharata, ramayana, Purans says( courtesy TV) but are ignorant to Upnashids, Gita and other such few books… even though we all have gita at home just to pay salutations every morning…
A book I highly recommend on some of the same terrain is Nicholas Dirks’ “Castes of Mind”…
Kanchan Gupta is on fire….and may have caused this article from Hindu…
It is really sad and pathetic jo ho raha hai India mein aajkal- Secular kee aad mein !!
Dear Javed Anand, Muslim grievance dates back to 1991? Know what, Hindu grievance dates back to 1206. Beat that.
Dear Javed Anand, when you gloss over desecration of Amar Jawan Jyoti by your co-religionists, message is not lost. Enjoy your biriyani
Next time a Muslim rages over 1991 or 2002, look him/her in the eye and say, “I have been angry since 1206.” Stunned silence shall follow
The Buddhists have been angry since the 6th or 7th centuries when they were more or less driven out of India. The problem with any history of ‘grievance’ is that it always involves a certain selection. Much as Muslims are invaders but ‘Aryans’ aren’t! Or in the history generated by the right this is all a colonial myth! This is where most people lose the moral argument. So yes let’s account for the horrors inflicted by many Muslim conquerors (for example the desecration/destruction of religious sites comparable to Mecca/Medina/Jerusalem in the Muslim consciousness… and here Muslims too should be criticized for not taking these facts seriously) but let’s also account for histories less selective than this.
On that note though best Eid wishes to all..
do try to visit gaya and see how much buddhists are coming there for tourism including a certain hollywood star of pretty women fame(its a place scared to buddha who he is role model among indian youths including certain section of hinduism for record india never had problem with buddhist china but it had with communist china and its a basic fact)
who gave shelther to dalai lama and btw buddhism is adored my any and one find any grievances there even if a people convert there(as part of santan dharma)…instead of moral argument one find a manufactured argument here
jerusalem indeed is holy place of certain religion and so is mecca and medina but in case of ayodhya a certain religion is struggling to even get the place of worship there ( for record non muslims are not allowed in mecca or medina and even there is strict restriction on jerusalem the holy place of christians )
happy eid to all
There are no restrictions in Jersusalem. Because of politics certain decisions are taken from time to time but it’s not like Mecca.
On the rest the number of Buddhists in India are negligible as a percentage. This didn’t happen by accident. Buddhists and the Hindu orthodoxy had a religious battle that lasted some centuries. Eventually the Buddhist side lost. This idea that ‘Hindus’ have throughout history been welcoming all faiths to India in peaceful fashion is a total myth.
The thing is human nature does not change irrespective of religion or ethnicity or other facets of culture. What changes are a set of political decisions. If one thinks one group has acted completely differently from another one has not explored the relevant histories deeply enough. and part of this involves being clear about which histories came about when. Just because the right in India today defines Hindu history in certain ways doesn’t mean that this is what the actual historical record says.
right is not always right
in present day india its not certainly the cae where like talibans buddha’s statues are destroyed btw are you are aware who have destroyed the maximum stupas(of buddhism) after temples in north india
“in present day india its not certainly the cae where like talibans buddha’s statues are destroyed”
Unless it’s a mosque in Ayodhya! I never knew India could pat itself on the back for not stooping to the atrocious levels of the Taliban.
This whole idea that India was a paradise before the Muslims arrived and introduced everything that is toxic is deeply misplaced, deeply unhistorical.
And whether Muslims destroyed Buddhist structures or not Buddhism was a negligible minority in India, much persecuted, in total retreat, before the first Muslim ever set foot in India!
but that thing(dispute) is out there in court for last 150 years even before indian independence and frankly it was rajiv ( who was not right) played with fire by opening up poojas there in mid 80′s and in same way totally diverting the justice of supreme court in nusrat’s case( a classic of appeasement in both cases)
india may be paradise or not but who has tinkered the history time again( certainly not right when one goes by nuetral history)
who has ruled india for last 55 plus year and framed history and frankly it is best on severe distortion to
Ayodhya in very simple terms was just effect of Shah Bano case( it was Cause) … Rajiv was taken on ride by typical sycophants and aides on that… it gave birth to the term “Appeasement” into national debate and consciousness along with Psuedo- secular and led to chain reaction and still going on
thanks for correcting shah bano ( pop out of my mind and told nusrat) and these people have problem with uniform civil code
and to be clear my only point is that all nations have these self-serving myths often shaped by one side of the political equation or the other. So not singling India out but the right’s version of history is a ridiculous fiction. This does not mean Muslims in India weren’t often a destructive force but this isn’t the whole story and in any case one has to look at these things historically using the standards of that age.
Agree, On essence of what you are saying/implying
and this implies to India also.. I wholeheartedly Agree…
Satyam sir- History is about to repeat it self…..in 20-30 years India will be full of Pakistanis and Bangladeshis….every state will be like Kashmir soon ( except may be Gurat )….
Jab inn lefties ley backyard mein aa kar rahenge yeh Bangladeshis then they will come to their seneses but by then it will be too fucking late…….
Some healthy paranoia on the right is always a good ‘correction’ to such discussions!
I am really happy you at least called my parnoia healthy…LOL
Its again which side of History one reads and accepts ..
If “Left Leaning historian” courtesy Nehru after independence than we see hindus have indulged in violence against Buddhist and there structures
and if ‘Right leaning Historian” than nothing like that ever happened in India..
At the end, History is always written by Powerful man or Nations so Nietzsche has somewhat rightly said, ” History is nothing but distortion of Facts..
But Nietzsche’s quote also doesn’t imply that all history is just a relative game. Who does the writing is crucial as a philosophical problem. However this doesn’t mean that things are completely unknowable (assuming something like a historical record exists).
The Rajiv Gandhi stoking of the issue is not really relevant to the larger point I’m making.
Eid mubarak to everyone at SS……
;) Kya dekhne aaye thaiy iss dead thread per kya hoo raha hain… :)
aur phir crime master Goga ki tarah soncha hooga, ” Aaya hoon toh kuch toh likh k jaavoga :) “
ha ha….. .. I try not to engage in discussions these days..apnee baat kaho aur chup ho jaao..bas! LOL
Re : I try not to engage in discussions these days..apnee baat kaho aur chup ho jaao..bas!
Samajhdaari ka Pehla aur Akhri Lakshan :)
aapsey seeekh raha hoon…
The world according to Harish: Salve slams gov, 2G, retro amends, rubbish tribunals, mining, French rev & more…
super stuff, I became her fan when during the Arun Shourie’s interview she said that she did have problems with MF Husaain painting nude Hindu Gods.
bliss: are you jouralism ….brilliant
answer to his ancessator was given by sardar only…
how mainstream media ignores this is pathetic to say the lease
sorry i meant journalist and sorry for typos
one of the only good thing to have happened was operation polo and it was done mostly in absence of nehru( i guess satyam won’t jump here on me on history part again but you can’t ignore your this aspect of history )
madani today the man accused to be part of serial bomb blasts is also part of mainstream politics
(question to be asked why suddenly there was resurgence of right in last decade and the answer is there in front of you that is appeasement and policy of divide and rule)
Dinesh D’Souza is a big right-winger, when he was with Reagan at least he was just a conservative. In recent decades he’s become like so many on the right ‘loony’ and lends himself to such fringe efforts.
thank you Di jee…. was a nice read, the documentry is doing pretty well box-offfice wise here…..
For all of Obama’s faults the alternative is much worse….
there’s a very interesting new book on the stimulus called ‘the New New Deal’ which shatters many negative myths surrounding the package. as always the sane history takes a while in coming about. In the meantime the likes of Dinesh D’Souza can make hay!
Of course I do agree that at the moment it’s not about choosing between two alternatives. There’s only one choice. The other side is crazy! And it’s at raving lunacy level at the moment!
Re.-Don’t know why all the prominent Indians have ended up in the Republican party
LMAO !!! may be they want to preserve their wealth….
aside- the Infomercial of Romney at Fox yesterday was a new low…
LOL Rocky..u actually watch Fox??!!
naa I like to swiych channels on Sunday Morning though…
This was Karma-
On Tuesday afternoon, House Speaker John Boehner (R-Ohio) called for a full delegation vote on the rules, including the ones the Paul backers opposed. The voice vote of ayes and nays were equal in volume, but Boehner immediately gave it to the ayes, leading to loud boos and shouts from Paul supporters
Bobby Jindal Appeals Ruling On Bernette Johnson, Black Supreme Court Justice
Reuters | Posted: 09/08/2012
By Kathy Finn
NEW ORLEANS, Sept 8 (Reuters) – Lawyers for Republican Louisiana Governor Bobby Jindal have challenged a U.S. federal judge’s ruling that would allow a black state supreme court justice to become the court’s next chief justice.
Jindal, who is Indian-American, on Friday asked an appeals court to review a lower-court decision to allow black justice Bernette Johnson’s to succeed a white chief justice retiring next year.
The dispute over whether Johnson should be the first black justice to head the Louisiana court has highlighted long-standing racial tensions in the state.
The state constitution stipulates that the longest-serving associate justice takes the top post. Johnson began serving on the state Supreme Court in 1994 while white justice Jeffrey Victory did not join the court until 1995.
But Johnson was initially appointed to the Supreme Court, not elected, as part of a state settlement with the federal government over racial discrimination that expanded the court to seven justices from six.
The other members of the current court, who are all white, contend that Johnson does not have the seniority to be the next chief justice. Johnson’s colleagues on the court say that her first six years as an appointed justice should not count toward her seniority.
Current chief justice Catherine Kimball attempted to resolve the dispute by asking members of the court to file briefs arguing the issue and having outside judges rule on succession.
But Johnson took her case to federal court, asking that the 20-year-old voting rights case be reopened and that her full tenure on the Supreme Court be reaffirmed.
In a statement released by one of his lawyers, Jindal said the matter should be settled by the Louisiana Supreme Court and the federal government should not be involved.
“The issue on appeal is not who should serve as the next Chief Justice, but whether the Louisiana Supreme Court should be prohibited by a federal court from interpreting the state’s constitution,” he said in the statement.
A lawyer for Johnson called Jindal’s position a throwback to the days when Southern states used the principle of “states rights” as a smokescreen for racism.
“That’s what the proponents of slavery said during the Civil War. It’s an age-old excuse,” said attorney James Williams.
In Hampi, India, the remains of a great but forgotten empire( WaPo)
This Indian Rome wouldn’t last, however. In 1565, an alliance of Muslim invaders known as the Deccan Sultans laid waste to the empire, defacing statues, razing temples and putting the empire’s citizens to the sword.
“For a space of five months Vijayanagar knew no rest. The enemy had come to destroy, and they carried out their object relentlessly. They slaughtered the people without mercy, broke down the temples and palaces,” Sewell wrote. “Never perhaps in the history of the world has such havoc been wrought, and wrought so suddenly, on so splendid a city.”
But even with all their carnage and destruction, the Deccan invaders couldn’t erase the grandeur of the place.
“Of all the places I’ve been in India, I like Hampi the best,” said Gheorghiu, who had just spent several months traveling around the country. “It’s like the fighting stopped yesterday.” Now, after spending two days walking through Hampi, I agreed with him.
Brilliant Informative piece on blasphemy in pakistan
How to commit blasphemy in Pakistan : Hanif Mohammed
Fourteen years ago, around the time young Rimsha Masih, now in jail under Pakistan’s blasphemy law, was born, a Roman Catholic bishop walked into a courthouse in Sahiwal, quite close to my hometown in Central Punjab. The Right Rev John Joseph was no ordinary clergyman; he was the first native bishop in Pakistan and the first ever Punjabi bishop anywhere in the world. He was also a brilliant and celebrated community organiser, the kind of man oppressed communities look up to as a role model. Joseph walked in alone, asking a junior priest to wait outside the courthouse. Inside the court, he took out a handgun and shot himself in the head. The bullet in his head was his protest against the court’s decision to sentence a fellow Christian, Ayub Masih, to death for committing blasphemy. Masih had been charged with arguing with a Muslim co-worker over religious matters. The exact content of the conversation cannot be repeated here because that would be blasphemous. The bishop had campaigned long and hard to get the blasphemy law repealed without any luck. He wrote prior to his death: “I shall count myself extremely fortunate if in this mission of breaking the barriers, our Lord accepts the sacrifice of my blood for the benefit of his people.”
Yes, also watched Tavleen Singh’s….both were pretty good..
Di- did you watch Anna Hazare and Kejriwals segment on India Today Agenda….Anna comes across as a leader who has suddenly lost most of his supporters to Kejriwal…Mani Shnkar Aiyyer is an Arrogant SOB…….
yes…watched it just now. Also questions that Javed Akhtar had for Kejriwal; AJ answered them patiently.
I would have smacked MSA.
I think AJ’s life might be in grave danger (maybe I am watching too many hindi movies)
Yes you are right about MSA …..
I also saw the video of Imran khan, he too spoke very well and hope he comes to Power in Pakistan….
Kajol was the best, she spoke her mind as usual, and at one point said – “I am not going to answer that question”,….even Lalu asked her a question which she pretty politely snubbed him with her answer…
If you don’t know this Site then just Enjoy this gr888888888888 site : Media crooks
Bahut acchi site hai..went thru’ many blogs yesterday. Loved the one on gujaratis. At this rate all my housework will get neglected..reading blogs all day long..lol.
Simi Garewal has her site on utube..do watch her interviews with bachchans and Jackie Chan (and many others) that she has recently uploaded. I found Bachchan family very normal, felt terrible for Sanjay Leela Bhansali’s traumatic childhood; Jackie Chans was painfully honest.
seen Simi’s Iview on Tv and mostly think her iView’s with Rekha and jaylalitha were memorable …
But I love this mdiacrooks site and this guy Ravinar… Awesum :)
mediacrooks. hum. His entire life is to go on and on about Barkha, Rajdeep and Sagarika. He has got around 50 bhajan singers who agree with him always and those who are critical of him will be removed as smoothly. That is his version of democracy. And there is unabashed modi worship. Pot calling the kettle black.
You are free to hold this opinion but Its better to read his article on those name you listed out to know who’s stating the facts. Rest we all have option to be Ostrich, when it comes to the things we Like/love or Dislike/Hate.
Abt 50 Bhajan singers, let me tell you, Majority is not proof of truth :)
Atleast he is One man, right or wrong against the Entire Media that’s is completely sold out to Congress.
Ps: he writes more eloquently, on facts and beautifully than those name you listed out ( they are all sold out journo’s). So called Rajdeep sardesai has said Dawood is Patriotic and when caught starting asking for censorship and defamation.
rest I know you are Congi supported :)
And this fellow is also soldout to modi. So where is the difference between him and the people he is bashing everyday? Atleast the journalists he is bashing are more democratic than him. And there is something called persecution complex and paranoid symptoms.
As for being congress supporter, I support the lesser evil.
I m Just asking you refute him on Facts. Period. One can say blaha blaha till cows come home. take his article on any name you listed and than refute on facts.
There is nothing called lesser Evil, Its a twist of mind to support the thing we like.
Lesser Evil : Bhagalpur Riots, #84 Gujrat riots, 1984 Sikh riots, Kashmir prblm, Emergency, Destroying every know democratic insititution in country ( Courtsey IG). Corruption now at stratospheric level, Plights on minorities still Same as it was on 1947 ( Sachar Report), even worse, Creation of LTTE, Shah Bano Case, Opening of locks of Ram janam bhoomi… What are we talking here abt Evils ???
Rest I dont condone Gujrat Riots. All gulity must be Punished and If Modi is gulity as per law than Hi also, But same thing should be done to congress leaders Incl Late RG for sikh riots…
Sanjana…I am one of the bhajan singers and on record, I love Modi!!! Why do you blame him for reacting 2 days late when Sonia didn’t even react for over a week when the Delhi rape case happened or 1984 riots in Delhi? Why do you want just gujarat govt to react instantly! Godhara happens, kashmir pandit women are raped and killed and they become refugees in their own land, headless soilder’s come home and all you can think of is Modi…modi….poor modi becomes bali kaa bakra.!!!!! He gets as much attention from media/delhi because he is in power and congress cannot get gujarat while congress was the one who sowed the seeds of communalism in Gujarat so policitally in the first place. Maybe Sagarika and co can research on that and bring the truth to forefront. I am glad that a lone voice in the form of mediacrooks exists even though it doesn’t have .5% of visibility that NDTV and other media goons have! Glad to be part of that bhajan mandali.
Atleast RG was punished. When will the other killer get punished???
In Which countryand year was RG Punished ???
RG was punished by LTTE and IG was punished by sikhs.
Now some rightwingers who spread lies to win elections, who remind someone more coldblooded than Hitler must also know that they cant get away forever.
LOL ! Never expect Factual ans from Congi Supporter :)
Then Why in Hurry for Modi, Wait for same Justice.
Rest abt Congi and their Justice, Not a single person has been convicted in 84 Sikh riots which killed 3,600 sikhs and so far in Guj 150 convictions had taken place, 1000 ppl got killed in Guj, 250 by Army bullets and none by army bullets in sikh riots.
Ya I have seen that site , it is pretty good Bliss…
Well, have just discovered another poison-piece blogsite –the mediacrooks.org one. It’s cynical and mocking tone, the whole rightwing leaning…is there any humanism left in social media?
I grew up in a cosmopolitan town, never learning to hate, but accept India in all its diversity.Yet all that such sites do is fill up their space with hate and divisive talk. 65 years after independence we are more like a Disunited States of India. And it is the supposedly educated elite that is talking in this manner. The less educated, they simply get on with their lives, learn to co-exist despite differences.
Cynical in what sense??
Abt Humanism : As you sow, so shall you Reap. Its not Humanism only. Its abt Lies which print and E media spreads and When SM catches it and unearths it thn they start talking abt Morals, humanism and etc. See also comment above
That site is so repusive and full of hatred directed only at certain persons. While turning a dhritarashtra eye and supporting all the misdeeds of its chosen ones. It is no more catching lies but agenda driven. Many educated Indians are falling prey to it.
“I grew up in a cosmopolitan town, never learning to hate, but accept India in all its diversity..”
And it still is. India is best place in world for minority religion for instance. Try to be a muslim in any other country…see if you have a freedom that you will enjoy in India! They will circumcise you in africa, put you in burqa and not allow you to drive in certain parts…on and on. Best place is India. Instead of minority hindu in Pakistan I would be minority muslim in India any day!
@ Di –should inform that I am not a Muslim, but very much a Hindu, fairly religious though not overtly; but tolerant of all others–and have been lucky enough to have lived in cosmopolitan communities, always, whether in small company town or now in a southern city in a cosmopolitan colony. And my two Muslim neighbours, one Christian family–they are good people who do not thrust their religion on others faces.
Reality thankfully is different from internet forums with their shrill voices.
And forgot to mention freedom of speech (Owaisi) exists in india…try that kind of speech elsewhere (even USA) and see what happens.
Well said Di :)
They wont accept India is Democartic and sickular coz of Hindu Majiority Faith. rest show any place in Asia and even surrounding where democarcy has taken roots… where Majoirty faith is different.
In pakistan, this yr alone there were 25000 forced conversions of hindu’s ( official fig :) ), one can assume abt unofficial figures :P
people criticizing about mediacrooks, why dont you refute with facts? Thats what that guy does, question mainstream media’s lies, twists. If he has an agenda to expose sold out media, good for him and us, he should continue with that. Cant understand where humanism, repulsive, hitler came from????
The problem with him is he is not neutral.
Refute him on Facts if one has guts and honesty. Just ranting wont do.
Rest, him not neutral is Open secret, not like Barkha Dalal and Rajdeep and Sagarika, Vir Sanghvi, Vinod mehta, Vinod Sharma, Kumar kelkar and endless list who are Completely Congi spokesperson in the guise of journalists. They are more dangerous than former.
U are so worried abt his neutrality, why not abt those you like and listed out. they are all compromised. Read abt barkha and rajdeep, honestly you will hate them to know their Lies.
In what way they are more dangerous and to whom? I will never hate them because they analyse well and they are critical of Congress government on many occasions.
The way you say congi betrays you. Your kind of people use words like Italian barmaid, Italian waitress, sickular and other such gems on other forums using anonymous names. And many unmentionable gaalis too.
I have read and I read many comments in TOI, HT, CNN IBN live, NDTV where they publish all the trash which criticises congress and their own journalists without batting an eyelid. Rajdeep and Sagrika allow First Post articles by rabidly anti congress writers also. And what about lies by modi? He said 18000 crores were spent on Sonia’s illness. This person is unpalatble for many in the NDA itself for his ruthlessness, arrogance and allowing his own personality cult to rise to mammoth proportions. and internet world knows about internet slaves who do nothing but sit in front of computers working as PR and flooding with similar sounding comments.
You increase the number of sikh riot martyrs while decreasing the number of gujarat riots. Spreading lies will not make them truth.
Well said Sanjana.
Don’t put words in my mouth which I never say or said.
“You increase the number of sikh riot martyrs while decreasing the number of gujarat riots. Spreading lies will not make them truth.”
Google it and you will get official figures, I m not talking out of Hat like you.
You have not read whole picture or may have intentionally left it. Again google it or ask me i will Post the links here :P
Personality cult is Gift of Congress to Indian Polity… Nehru > IG> RG> SG>RG/PG > children of PG.
U must be knowing of Grt atrocious stmnt from Mr Buarwaha( If i recollect it correctly), India is Indira and Indira is india.
I Listed out the sins of cong party and you just list out one gujrat( Cant be condone, appaling) but still say, You ppl.
Again refute on facts, Everyone can write Proses and poetry but they dont become facts.
Rest its seems you dont know lies of the ppl you admire or you dont want to face them.
and Wat abt SG lie – maut ka saudgar :)
Yes Bhagat singh, Subhas Chander bose were also unpalatable to cong, that doesnt make them lesser :)
When Entire Media has become Voice of one single party to spread lies, lies and lies then ppl like you take them as gospel truth.
Bliss, first make yourself more clear than simply writing away whatever comes to you. You are contradicting yourself.
BJP is not a holy cow when it comes to spreading lies, supporting corruption and other evils besides being the most ludicrous party going haywire and nowhere.
With so many paid and unpaid internet slaves, it is not surprising they are active on google too.
I am Clear but Its seems you are going nowhere and cant refute facts. Who said BJP is Holy cow ??? not me. U said Cong is lesser Evil and some guy against them is paid. I put some grt acts of that lesser evil and U cant refute them in logical way. U said Modi lied with SG illness stmnt and I said wat abt maut ka Saudagar lie.. Hope u can see which one is greater???
U r Tying yourself in Knots :) I am just listing out facts and you write essays … Talk on and abt Facts. period. As you are going in circles, I m out of It Now.
Yes Good … I cant see you in web of knots :)
Watch this ESP those for whom gujrat is the only narrative and when they, so called liberals and sickulars completely ignored it. Kashmiri Pandit exodus and killing is most horriffic and appaling moments in modern India but completly ignored coz they are hindus and not minorities.. 4 lakh KP’s were made refugees in their own country and 1000 were killed and raped and 150 temples burnt or dstroyed.. but You wont hear anything on thier sad miserable plight from those in public life, Pol parties and sold out media, whom Gujrat or Babri strutcure is only narrative
It angers me !
Thanks Bliss, will watch it later…
This was a pretty informative watch and I could identify a lot with it…..
Yes I did miss out ..but do check out mediacrook’s blog for today…he talks abt this.
..streitsand effect…interesting….I like it a lot when writers bring out analogies…makes things very clear :-)
I liked the astrix/oblix one too
VVIP chopper deal: Jaswant Singh admits changes made in tender during NDA rule
Jaswant singh has taken wind out of BJP with this disclosure.
lol, they didnt change the tender so that Congress could take 200+ crores bribe. what a misleading report by ndtv as usual, without any logic or reasoning. they changed it bcoz altitude requirement was unnecessarily high and only 1 company qualified. After changing it, more companies qualified. They(IAF) put the altitiude requirement high so that only 1 will be qualified, which was fishy in the 1st place. NDA corrected it. and ofcourse UPA looted.
well said gryfinder
How can you say only UPA looted? Have you forgotten coffingate, Mahajan, Reddys? Pot calling kettle black?
Here is what Arun Jaitley said, – ” All that Brajesh Mishra did was that on the recommendations of experts,govt decided instead of single tender,multiple tenders needed. The tender is issued, finalized, awarded under the UPA govt.”
This is inline with MoD timeline report released today.
LOL.. the wind out ???
NDTV is called congress spouse channel :)
rest abt Wind, Just requirements were changed in 2003 to avoid what is called as Single vendor problem. In defence deals one doesnt allow Single vendor as single vendor can thn squeeze you… But if UPA is so honest than what were they doing since 2004. NDA only made requirement list. Period. deal happened in UPA period from scratch to finalisation in 2010. If UPA thought NDA did wrong by changing requirement list then why didnt they scrap the whole deal. When same issue were raised in march last year than why Mr Antony said, Everything is OK….
PS: Read Tavleen singhs Durbaar to know how Congress has screwed the nation, it only talks abt one PM, RG :)
The deal was ok but the bribes are not ok.
Now who took the bribes? They are pointing to Tyagi.
The question is why the defence minister who is known to be very honest, did not order an enquiry even after smelling rat.
Truth must comeout whether it is UPA or NDA.
And the armed forces reputation is going down the drain with each disclosure.
I agree as now details are coming as @timesnow that few big Journalists are also involved and Bribed… Trust me this Chopper scam will eventually turn out to be biggest defence scam ever…
Said firm has put aside Rs 370 crs for bribe and only some 60+ crs are tracked to Tyagi fellows and rest 300 crs is missing and now imagine who’s who :) … Media, Pol, Beuracrats and others…
But one thing is now sure, this Congress led Govt is Most Corrupt govt Ever in history of independant India.. They let the loot happen and Do nothing… As i cal MMS, SG, RG as 3 monnkeys, see no corruption, hear no corruption and say No corruption..
And our politicians will make few army man or General as Scapegoat of fall guy…
This 300 or 400 crores is too small an amount for politicians.
As for army, there are many army officers who make lots of money through corrupt means. They assist smuggling mostly and they also misuse canteen contracts. If they can do these things, they may do bigger scams too. Let their assets and their wives; and kids’s assets be checked for disproportionate wealth. Definiotely politicians or burocrats must have been involved.. As congress has the longest tenure, the possibility of corruption is more.
if they dig deeper massive corruption in the name of revamping of infrastructure in recent time is the next big thing
UPA ready for JPC probe. Pre empting opposition? Even this is problem for congress haters. The point is clear as crystal that congress haters have no problem with corruption but with congress government.
“It is incomprehensible to us that this is the man who the Wharton India Economic Forum wishes to celebrate as an exemplar of economic and social development. We find it astonishing that any academic and student body at the University of Pennsylvania can endorse ideas about economic development that are based on the systematic oppression of minority populations, whether in India or elsewhere,” the petition said, threatening an onsite protest against his presence, “virtual as it will be.”
“Our role as scholars and students—and indeed as would-be entrepreneurs and business managers — must be to develop conscientious and efficacious modes of economic organization, not to piggyback onto the inhuman policies of politicians who not only lack a commitment to human rights and to ideals of social justice, but whose political success is based on the suppression of substantial sections of their own citizens.
“Modi still does not have a US visa to enter the US, but Wharton plans to present him on Skype to the audience. Recently there have been efforts to whitewash Modi’s grim record and to grant him respectability. Wharton’s invitation lends itself to doing just that,” the petition added.
Modi has addressed other business meetings in the US over satellite. The difficulty Wharton faced in revoking the invitation came from the fact that many of its distinguished Indian alumni — Anil Ambani, for instance — do not share the purported ideological bias of his opponents. Ambani recently described Modi as a “king among kings” at the vibrant Gujarat summit.
Another problem: This year’s WIEF is sponsored by the Adani Group, also considered close to Modi.
The business groups in India are actively lobbying for Modi as PM so that they can control entire India real estate.
Many criticise Laloo for his rusticity, but the language used by Modi towards opposition is mean and wicked. He is simply not fit to rule such a diverse contry where one needs tolerance, empathy towards one and all.
Very well said Sanjana.
LOL… at now banal arguments :)
What happen to America’s FIRST AMENDMENT ???
This is what can be called as ‘Liberal Intolerance’… Hope ppl here remember Voltaire :(
And the Media groups lobbying for Amul baby and Congi
US Congressman sees Modi as India’s next PM
AHMEDABAD: US Congressman and ranking member Eni Faleomavaega today called upon the United States to begin a dialogue with Gujarat chief minister Narendra Modi.
He was speaking at “The Rebalance to Asia: Why South Asia Matters (Part I)”. Faleomavaega’s full statement was made part of the historical record and the text pertinent to chief minister Modi.
“I want to suggest that it is time for the US to begin a dialogue with Gujarat chief minister Narendra Modi who may very well be India’s next Prime Minister,” Faleomavaega said.
“The US-India relationship is significant. It is one of the defining partnerships of the 21st century, and CM Modi is a leading figure. Gujarat is a key state, which has contributed considerably to India’s economy. Companies like Ford and General Motors are setting up factories in Gujarat in a move that promises to strengthen US-India trade and investment.” he said.
“While I am aware of the 2002 communal riots and see eye to eye with the national and international community that what happened calls for justice and accountability, the fact remains that after an investigation that has been ongoing for almost a decade, India’s Supreme Court has not found any evidence against Modi. So I question the Supreme Court’s recent decision to allow for a new petition to be put forward.” he said.
The US Congressman also said he believed that the action was politically motivated and the US should shift its attitude and extend the hand of friendship to Modi, just like European Union and UK.
“India is essential for the success of the US rebalancing to Asia.” he said.
This is a very dishonest piece. Not because it operates on the right side of the equation but for the reason that is performs a number of deceptive maneuvers.
1)First off there is the sleight-of-hand on ‘liberals’. This is not unlike the protest of many even here on this blog. On the one hand one blames the left-liberal side when the right is criticized. One calls them unfair and totally ideological and so on. but on the other hand in a different context one also takes the very same liberals to task for not living up to their values! The very values that one finds completely illegitimate in the first place. So when the right is criticized using these very values it’s not as if anyone admits that the criticism is correct as long as one adopts that ideology. One just claims that it is not just an ideological position but also a false one. And yet this is the very same standard that the left must somehow live upto elsewhere when it is attacking the right. This is completely incoherent logic.
2) Then there is what I call the the Israel gambit. Where the standards shift on different ends of the equation. So Israel is very proud to be called the only democracy in the Mideast and so on. But when they’re criticized for human rights violations and the like they immediately point to Saudi Arabia and say ‘look what’s happening there’! You can’t be Switzerland one day and Syria the next! So again the right cannot criticize the left for any kind of violence or what have until it is also willing to recognize its own.
3)In this piece there’s a tricky co-optation strategy. So the writer puts forth a list of riots, all where minorities are disproportionately killed, sometimes in overwhelming number (by the way what does this do to the fantasy position of the right whereby Muslims have somehow been massacring the majority for the entire history of the nation-state?!), and then says that this is what the left did. But this very itemization is what the right has forever disqualified in the past. Suddenly the right is concerned about minorities?!
4)The last but not the least of these dishonest moves is in having the gall to distinguish riots from pogroms but refusing to identify Modi’s as such! And then using only the 1984 anti-Sikh one as an example. This is a bit like talking about totalitarian violence and excluding Hitler from the conversation!
again to be clear I am not getting into a debate I’ve already argued just recently. My point is that the terms of the debate exhibited in this piece are deeply dishonest and cynical. The yardstick of the left is used to deconstruct it but the same yardstick is refused when it comes to Modi! And again this is not dissimilar to many ordinary comments I hear in the same sense in various quarters. There is always a slippage involved. This is like some of those fans of certain stars who are willing to support the worst examples of commercial cinema on one side and then suddenly become great enthusiasts of meaningful cinema on the other! Or in another way the ones who attack Abhishek for flopping in meaningful stuff but then also attack him for being successful in ‘sellout’ movies!
n December of 2007, Karan Thapar wrote a column in the Hindustan Times with hateful rhetoric against Narendra Modi, using phrases like “sudden removal of Narendra Modi”. In July of 2010, Vir Sanghvi, writing in a column, called Narendra Modi a Serbian war criminal. This, after routinely slandering Modi as a “mass murderer” and likening him to Hitler.
In fact, one has lost count of the number of hate-filled columns written by assorted Left-liberal and Muslim commentators repeating the Hitler slur. Leave alone the amount of abuse and personal slander, including explicit threats, that come Modi’s way across social media on a daily basis.
Hence it was amusing to see celebrity television anchors and assorted voices in social media cry hypocrisy over Modi’s decision to protest the Sonia Gandhi-led UPA’s clumsy attempt at political censorship of the Internet. Narendra Modi protests censorship by UPA
Slandering Modi has been a matter of habit for many so-called ‘liberal’ commentators. In July of 2011, historian Ramachandra Guha got his history abysmally wrong when he sought to inject Modi into a column on free speech with false claims of a ban on a Aamir Khan movie. This was after another column by Guha in April of 2011 that reeked of class prejudice against Modi. One can count at least three editorials in the Indian Express over the past many years making false claims on Modi. Leave alone the manner in which clips from the movie Parzania were interlaced with Tehelka’s sting-op on the 2002 riots back in 2007 ahead of a key State election.
The sum total of the hatred and slander expressed towards Modi should make many sit up and wonder how many defamation suits, criminal complaints and content removal requests were filed?
In stark contrast to the thin-skinned celebrity anchors and the Sonia Gandhi-led Congress, not even one complaint was filed.
Apart from independent MPs like Rajeev Chandrashekhar, Modi is the only major politician who has been steadfast in speaking up on attempts to censor the Internet. Not even the other rockstar politician in social media, Shashi Tharoor, has been unequivocal in speaking out on social media freedom.
Those ‘liberals’ who bring up the two book bans by Modi’s Government in Gujarat should look within for having failed the Evelyn Beatrice Hall test on free speech themselves on Subramanian Swamy’s column in DNA. As despicable and bigoted that column was it did not issue a call for violence while seeking to accomplish the bigoted agenda by the most constitutional of means — a two thirds majority in Parliament.
Those who could not find within themselves to defend Swamy’s right to free but bigoted speech have no credibility in judging others’ record on free speech. The two book bans while unfortunate pale in significance when compared to the extent of tolerance Modi has shown towards his most vicious critics in social media and mainstream media.
The reality of free speech in India is there is none given the spate of laws and court judgements. Rather than getting into a lose-lose debate of one upmanship over free speech credentials, all digitally active Indian citizens must recognise that this was an attempt at political censorship by the Sonia Gandhi-led UPA. Instead of getting sanctimonious over free speech credentials every digitally active citizen should join in to speak up against this political censorship lest a wrong precedent be set that will come back to haunt them in future.
a pretty dishonest comment usually bodering on same age old parrot like rheotric frankly
who where the honest figures figting case and the face of medika ;
the great teesta who swallowed the fund of victims…so many commision and SIT working overtime so that amul baby’s path should be clear and whats the result on ground
calling sikh riots as one off incident to ignore is again a spin frankly…what is the history of gujrat riots between eighty five and ninety two its worst and the so called fantacy was true
do google on someone called zafari between this period who was sitting mla particularly on riots
I Said Must read only for Facts( the num of deaths in each riot) it lists out, not about right or wrong. I dont condone violence as I have been victim of same. But my main problem is Why media and so called liberals and sickulars only harp on NaMO, single note and single deity for them. Why not use same adjectives for other so called gr8 leaders like Indira and rajiv and other chief ministers of like UP and Gujrat. Just because Namo is right wing and it keeps the job of liberals and sickulars intact, Money flowing, patronage safe and sound and politics live and scapegoat for them…
If Indira Gandhi after killing 3000 assamese and RG after killing 3,500 sikhs in better and coordinated Pogrom of ’84 are Sickulars than In India everyone is sickular. If so called muslim parties of J&K are sickulars after throwing and ethnic cleansing of KP’s of which congress was part are sickular as per Media and Intelligentsia Narrative, what more can one say ???
Rest I agree with lot of points you raise, but problem arise when person of any other faith than Hinduism says He/She is so and so than Media calls it religious freedom and proud of identity and when same is uttered by Hindu, He/She is labelled as communal as per media and intelligentsia narrative…
Use same parameters, yardstick. Nothing less, Nothing more..
Its not one against other.
One has no right to take life, not even state for that matter.
Gujarat-based billionaire entrepreneur Gautam Adani followed Shiv Sena leader Suresh Prabhu’s footsteps and cancelled his scheduled visit to the Wharton School of the University of Pennsylvania after the institute cancelled its invitation to Gujarat Chief Minister Narendra Modi. The BJP leader was scheduled to deliver the keynote address at the Wharton India Economic Forum via video conference later in February.
Adani Group is the main sponsor of the Wharton India Economic Forum. Wharton cancelled Modi’s address saying it fears polarising reactions if Modi is invited, after a group of professors and students at Wharton had protested at his invitation.
The organisers said a prominent Indian leader will be delivering the address instead, whose name will be announced soon. The organising committee of the prestigious annual event apologised for putting the University and the Wharton School administration in a “difficult position”.
It is the billionaire group, the big industrialists and their friends who are pushing for Modi. We have so many articles in all the newspapers favourably about Modi. Paid news? Nothing can be ruled out.
Nothing is spontaneous. Everything is well organised.
Interesting Ann Jo..especially after what NaMo had said abt Tharoor’s wife sometime back. short term memories in politics. lol
Tharoor is HOTTTT ;-):-)
something about keralites with light eyes….lolz
Thanks Bliss, That was a great Catch, the latest one is a Journalist from “Hindu” tweeting and then deleting that MMS and Modi should have died before Chavez!!
Annjo- watching it right now !! thanks for the link…
LMAO !! MSA total Sathiya gaye hain ……
Aside- in another debate Sadanand Dhume ney Commie Professor from JNU kee sookhi lee thee……… La La land !!
ha ha haa…MSA’s rants at 16.00 ticker is hilarious…where the hell is Meenakhshi Lekhi……LOL!!!
Thanks you for this link. I read all the columns under “Community Reactions to WIEF disinvite” and their comments, and it was quite fascinating, and educational. I only wish that the participants in the discussion had included more than a handful of Americans (I counted a maximum of 5, some of them iffy). Otherwise, it was the usual exchange of views/barbs by Indians, for Indians, and of Indians. :) However, the DP editorial was interesting.
“Pakistan is hostile to all non-Muslims. That is a simple, cold truth. The laws are discriminatory and the pious population does not like the non-believers either”
It is not terribly shocking news now, is it?
On the other hand, I have always said this…India is best place for minorities:
“Lashkar-e-Taiba, may think that Pakistan is the best Islamic nation for the Bollywood star, Shahrukh Khan to move to, but it is India that is arguably the best Muslim country today. Muslims in India enjoy complete political and religious liberty, a free legislative environment to undertake economic and educational initiatives, a vibrant television media and cinema that teach liberal coexistence, and access to a vast number of universities and institutes of modern education. There is absolutely no Muslim country that offers such a vast array of freedoms to its people.”
And the author is muslim! http://dailytimes.com.pk/default.asp?page=2013%5C03%5C16%5Cstory_16-3-2013_pg3_5
while this is too rosy a view of India in certain respects it is true that compared to the Pakistani side of the equation it seems fully justified! Here’s another very recent piece along the same lines:
Of course the reason I argue against Hindutva so often is precisely because I see their choices as leading to the Pakistan kind of option. They’ve in any case been fairly robust in terms of attacking minorities (not just Muslims but Christians as well). The Hindutva paradise is really the mirror image of the Pakistan one. A land for Hindus much as Pakistan is a land for Muslims. This kind of logic always has chilling consequences and we see the results in Pakistan. A country that has problems not just with all religious minorities (including those within Islam) but also one where half the country was lost decades ago because of anti-Bengali bias.
And so when the Indian state is justly celebrated in this regard one should always remember that it is the Nehruvian ideal that shines through in these respects and it is this very ideal that the Hindutva forces have been at war with decades. Once again because they precisely do not like the idea of a liberal democracy that strives to include everyone. Pakistan is the ultimate cautionary tale. Of course it’s quite humorous to see some who are otherwise quite soft on Hindutva make this point!
Thanks Bliss..Interesting read, however I for one am Not in favor of NaMo becoming the PM.
His rise will mean the end of BJP.
You need more Education laced with wisdom :P
ha ha…always ready for both.
can’t see so because there is hardly anyone else
infact his rise as politician is as dramatic as one get …father used to see tea which he did to …abandoned wife when child marriage was done and still not married and even in delhi used to be in bjp’s third rung leader when sahib singh verma was at helm ….certainly rise is astonishing
further most of the ngo’s who helmed riots during day in and out had funding from government a case which slowly got exposed and in elections big funding from green countries are coming to ..in 2014 lot of noise of 2002 will be seen
further history is very astonishing
congress very easily has destroyed oppositin in last 60 year or so
Because of the socialism and socialist model of development entrepreneurship and competition did not nurture and youths of the nation always aspire to become the clerks. For several decades country faced the stagnation and due to leftist and socialist outlook several decisions become hostage to ideological dogma as the decision to start diplomatic relations with Israel was taken after almost four decades of its formation and this delay was less to do with the sentiments of Indian Muslims but more to the influence of left elites in decision making in Indian government who always manipulated things and distort it to create panic in ruling class to serve their world view.
The real reason behind the opposition of the chief Minister of Gujarat Narendra Modi is his model of governance which has provided an alternate to Nehruvian socialist Model of governance and it has made restless to leftist and socialists in India who are scared to lose their monopoly in ruling elite.
Great piece of articles refuting most of things said on Gujarat Riots by Madhu Kishwar
Gurgaon represents Nehruvian India, a state where the sole purpose of the administration is self-perpetuation and the squeezing of surplus from citizens not privileged to be “New British”, i.e. officials or politicians. It is a construct that has been embraced by both these groups, for the power it gives them over the lives of ordinary citizens. Just as British apologists for colonial loot talked of the “civilising” effects of the Raj, claiming that everything from railways to roads would never have come about but for them, India’s post-1947 New British chatter incessantly about “democracy”, a system whereby less than a dozen families rule over three-fourths of those elected to state and national legislatures. Talking to those whose workplace is atop Raisina Hill, it is difficult not to imagine that they consider themselves to be the rulers of a vast colony, which is the rest of India. That they, and they alone, have the right to decide matters that affect any state, any district. Indeed, that the rest of the country is simply incapable of self-governance
ehruvian ideology and methods are based on the implicit belief that the Raj was the best thing that ever happened to India, and that therefore its institutions, mindset and laws ought to be retained in their entirety. That the people of India are not mature enough to be trusted with superintending their own destinies, and therefore need to constantly check back with some minion or the other of the administration before being allowed to do even simple tasks. Simply put, the politico-administrative elite that replaced the British in 1947 are the only adults in the country, and the rest are just children. Small wonder that Indians have not been given the access to the internet bandwidth that others in Asia enjoy, or while Japan has 5G, India still crawls along with 3G, where that service is available at all. The choke points that the British erected succeeded in emasculating the Indian economy. The continuation of the colonial policy of excessive regulation ensures that India grows at a speed less than half of the 15% that the genius of its people would easily achieve, if only they were given the same conditions that are enjoyed by counterparts in other countries.
Enter Narendra Modi. All of him is Indian, none of him owes anything to Raj influences. Were he to ever become Prime Minister, he would be unlikely to go the Vajpayee way, accepting the Nehru model of governance, including in foreign and education policy, rather than ensuring that the country move on from the shadow of the British occupation. Modi wants the English language to spread in India, but not British attitudes. He trusts domestic industry and wants it to expand to foreign shores, rather than dwarf them in favour of foreign companies. Only in Nehruvian India can the civil servant who crafted the laws and regulations that enabled Vodafone to avoid paying nearly $4 billion in taxes on a wholly India-based transaction continue to enjoy his or her retirement. In a country less enslaved by its colonial past, the person would have been brought to account. In Gujarat, Modi has not followed the model of the man responsible for ensuring that Jawaharlal Nehru got anointed to continue the legacy of the Raj, but Vallabbhai Patel. Those who want to know what India would have looked like under 17 years of Patel need only go to Modi’s Gujarat.
great piece, however Modi is No Vallabhbhai Patel !!
Aside- Modi supporters are now trying to undermine Vajpayee’s achievements by comparing Vajpayee to Nehru in order to show how good Modi Is…..Fuck That !!!
R U on Twitter?????
nahee yaar, barely able to cope with SS LOL!!
Aside- my cousins in India bulldozed me to join Whatsup recently, I resisted for very long time but finally succumbed …
OK… U raised Vajpayee issue so asked coz in India, esp BJP lot is going on and Twitter is best place both as producer and consumer of news…
not on twitter but sometimes I do read Kanchan gupta and saswati sarkar’s tweets…
And bigb’s too..I am sure Rocky!
P.S. I am all for Modi as PM. He is what India needs badly. young (for indian politics), dynamic, brave, idealistic. etc Modiji ki Vijay ho. Jai ho.
Ya , Big B and Satyam too…
infigting because lot of them in bjp don’t want modi because of towering stature
aside vajpayee was intrumental in bringing commonwealth and lobbying it for india and look how others implemented it on a structure laid
golden quadilateral was a gem of scheme and even it is changed to dynasty’s name and when people talk about growth things to remember after nuclear test india faced lot of economic sanction and finally became reliant and its other powers who had to revoke it and keep on generating jobs….atleast air india was beginning to revive but look what praful patel and other damad …a case with celebi etc etc
On a side note blissy, I had honour of meeting Dr Swami on his foreign trip. He is articulate, intellectual and all that we know but also strikingly handsome man even at this age :-) Must have been a stunner in his youth!!